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Replacing Valve Stem Seals without pulling head 01 Jul 2011 12:47 #460465

  • Joe Fabulous
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If it's smoking like you say at 75mph etc you need to look at pistons and rings, it would be false economy not to check while it's in bits.

Check pistons, rings, bores etc, if they're ok then move on to valves, guides and seals.

Forget valve clearances and all the other stuff, they need checking but won't make you burn oil. If you want to do that stuff it's fine but don't let it cloud the main issue which is oil consumption.

When alls said and done if you check out the bores and pistons and all are ok it hasn't cost you anything but a gasket but has given you peace of mind.

Hope that helps put things into context.
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1982 KZ1100 A2
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Replacing Valve Stem Seals without pulling head 01 Jul 2011 12:52 #460467

  • 79MKII
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I agree with Joe and wouldn't trust the base gasket after pulling off the head anyway. Just pull the jugs, inspect the rings, pistons, and cylinders. If they look OK, move to the valves.
The Kaw List:
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Replacing Valve Stem Seals without pulling head 01 Jul 2011 13:42 #460476

  • pctech101
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well here is what head looks like and top side of pistons:
picasaweb.google.com/wiegman73/MotorcycleTeardown

cylinder 2 & 3 have oil in intake port. 1-3 pistons are oil wet. pulled valave one intake and guid doesnt wiggle. i destroyed seal try'n to get it out.

will put pics of pistons up shortly

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Replacing Valve Stem Seals without pulling head 01 Jul 2011 14:07 #460482

  • Joe Fabulous
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I'd say it's definately pistons after looking at the pictures, loads of oil in there. It even looks like it's washed all the carbon off the piston crowns there's so much of it.
2004 Harley Davidson Softail
1981 Z1000 Chop
1982 KZ1100 A2
XS 650 Plunger Chop (in bits)

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Replacing Valve Stem Seals without pulling head 01 Jul 2011 14:45 #460484

  • pctech101
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look at picture of piston. you can see the oil rings 123 all dont have the butting lip on one side.

Now please tell me there is a source to get 3 oil rings for decent price and where that source may be.

I just want to thank yall. Appreciate all yalls help. Yall know yalls stuff.

Just upped pic of ring for heck of it

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Last edit: by pctech101.

Replacing Valve Stem Seals without pulling head 01 Jul 2011 19:17 #460529

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any of yall have recommendations on how i can get just oil rings cheaply, or should i see if i still have my old ones?

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Replacing Valve Stem Seals without pulling head 01 Jul 2011 19:23 #460532

  • ELCouz
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I think they only comes in ring kit...

Ask your kawa dealer about that...

check this out.... www.z1enterprises.com/detail.aspx?ID=192

i think its cheaper than buying from the dealer.

Quote from ELCouz

...Bets are open for problem is underneat


Why nobody bet on this????.... i could have made money and fix my darn motorcycle :P
1982 KZ810-R1 GPZ with hindle 4-into-1 pipe

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Last edit: by ELCouz.

Replacing Valve Stem Seals without pulling head 01 Jul 2011 20:52 #460544

  • pctech101
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anyone know what the piston size is and how big the gap is for oil ring?

my book in wear limits states:
Oil groove width .103in
Piston OD: 2.846

Is this what i need to try to find a ring?

i do have 3 of my old oil rings, the ones that suppose to but together. what is the opinion on reusing them?

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Last edit: by pctech101.

Replacing Valve Stem Seals without pulling head 01 Jul 2011 21:30 #460552

  • ELCouz
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anyone know what the piston size is and how big the gap is for oil ring?


Should be 72.5 mm bore if larger than that you don't have stock pistons

how big the gap is for oil ring


I don't have access to a KZ1000 FSM...sorry i can't help you with these specs (vary by models)

i do have 3 of my old oil rings, the ones that suppose to but together. what is the opinion on reusing them?

I would not recommend doing that unless you are ready to pull apart the engine again few miles later in case something is wrong again... piston rings are usually throw away stuff (single use)

If you want a sex analogy...piston rings are like condoms... you can reuse them but you might run into trouble later ;)

Since the head is off...looks for damage on pistons and cylinder wall (turn the crankshaft while pulling taunt the cam chain to reveal cylinder wall)... scratch on wall is no good for oil consumption.

After checking with dealer ... kawasaki makes them only in kits it means you get compression rings and oil rings...

Buy from z1enterprises its cheaper...part you are looking for anyway is #13008-5055 RING-SET-PISTON,STD

If you have oversized pistons you need different ring kit please double check before buying or you will have excessive ring gap!
1982 KZ810-R1 GPZ with hindle 4-into-1 pipe

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Last edit: by ELCouz.

Replacing Valve Stem Seals without pulling head 01 Jul 2011 23:14 #460574

  • Motor Head
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Well it is great to see you got it apart. That oil ring expander, you must have had some trouble when the block went on. I would think a expander to break like that, the oil ring is probably bent as well. ELCouz is right, as far as I know all the parts houses would have rings as a set either for 1 piston, or for all 4. Oil rings by themselves would be very hard to source. Better to get fresh for any cylinder you have doubts about, might be all 4. Better now than be in there again. Don't forget to measure your valve clearance and order shims as well if needed. On size, you should be able to clean the crud off the top of the piston. If oversize it should be stamped as such. Otherwise should be STD but only measuring will tell you. You could take it to be checked, the pistons and cylinders. Or maybe your Dad has a set of Mic's, and bore gauge? He should have some different feeler gauges?
1982 KZ1000LTD K2 Vance & Hines 4-1 ACCEL COILS Added Vetter fairing & Bags. FOX Racing rear Shocks, Braced Swing-arm, Fork Brace, Progressive Fork Springs RT Gold Emulators, APE Valve Springs, 1166 Big Bore kit, RS34's, GPZ cams.
1980 KZ550LTD C1 Stock SOLD Miss it
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Replacing Valve Stem Seals without pulling head 02 Jul 2011 00:11 #460581

  • pctech101
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Motor Head wrote: Well it is great to see you got it apart. That oil ring expander, you must have had some trouble when the block went on. I would think a expander to break like that, the oil ring is probably bent as well.

yeah, if the tabs were on there when i installed oil rings, i might know exactly how they got broke off. when i originally put rings on it and went to put it together the jugs didnt slide into the pistons easily, my dad tapped a wood block on cylinders forcing cylinders down. after he got piston 2 wedged into cylinder 2, i through a fit. being my first time doing this kind of internal work, i didnt second guess him til he rounded the cotter pin on the mechanical advance trying to force pistons into moving into cylinders. i told him at that point we were done. i went back with a friend and we got the piston freed. i went back after i had cylinder honed again because the cylinder was marred by the little delicate thin oil ring. luckily it is lower than the stroke of the piston. anyhow, when i reassembled it, it was just me, balancing the jugs as i let it down helping the rings into the cylinders. reassembled and here we are 200+ miles afterwards.

Motor Head wrote: Better to get fresh for any cylinder you have doubts about, might be all 4. Better now than be in there again.

Well 123 all have damaged oil ring so thats 3 sets. i see nothing wrong with 4.
Question, do i need to have cylinders honed again when just replacing oil rings?

Motor Head wrote: Don't forget to measure your valve clearance and order shims as well if needed.

i popped valve 1 intake off. have to figure out how to install new valve stem seals and get valves reinstalled. i used socket with magnet in end and a hammer to get valve 1 out. not sure how you put back in(get valve keepers back in place). please suggest what i need to do to install valve stem seals and valves and what tools i should need?

Motor Head wrote: On size, you should be able to clean the crud off the top of the piston. If oversize it should be stamped as such. Otherwise should be STD but only measuring will tell you. You could take it to be checked, the pistons and cylinders. Or maybe your Dad has a set of Mic's, and bore gauge? He should have some different feeler gauges?

I believe it is stock piston, if it wasnt and i put standard rings on it number 4 would of smoked or had low compression, correct? dad doesnt have his toolbox accessible right now. he can borrow a tool for me sometimes, just have to know what it is called. he loaned me some feelers to use but lowest feeler is .005 and i need to measure from .002.

i dont want to have anymore mistakes. all of yalls suggestions are appreciated and desired.
i want my baby running good.

help me make sure i am getting all parts i need, please.
3 sets of standard rings, 8 piston snap rings, jugs gasket, head gasket, 4 cylinder head o-rings(for gallies. yall recommend a source for these), shims, valve cover gasket.
anything else yall recommend?

thanks for yalls help so far.

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Last edit: by pctech101.

Replacing Valve Stem Seals without pulling head 02 Jul 2011 01:23 #460588

  • elfmagic17
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[/quote]Well 123 all have damaged oil ring so thats 3 sets. i see nothing wrong with 4.
Question, do i need to have cylinders honed again when just replacing oil rings?[/quote]

As long as you can still see the crosshatch patern in the cylinders and there is no abnormal vertical scratches you should be fine to go back together with out honeing again.
Kenny Hicks
74 Honda CB550
75 Honda CB360 (runs and rides good but not a show bike)
77 KZ650B1 (Runs Great, but needs painted and a little work.)

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