Best Place To Have Stator Rewound?

Was Stator 5 now burned out, broken, or damaged?
This 3 phase off of the fifty, did you use the same R/R that was used with the other tests, or the 1 that goes with it off of the Fifty?
I would have thought that the AC volts reading from 68 up would be enough for your system, but as said that is unloaded. With that R/R seeming to be set a bit low, it may be worth getting the 1 from the Oregon fellow if the 1 from the Fifty is no good. You have tried it? is it the 5 wire with the brown B+ sense?
Hows the Fifty wiring harness? Could you swap it and use the Whole system with the 3 phase and R/R?

Oh See is a evil but sexy looking girl, lured ya right in wagging her tail!

Motor Head wrote:

Was Stator 5 now burned out, broken, or damaged?
This 3 phase off of the fifty, did you use the same R/R that was used with the other tests, or the 1 that goes with it off of the Fifty?
I would have thought that the AC volts reading from 68 up would be enough for your system, but as said that is unloaded. With that R/R seeming to be set a bit low, it may be worth getting the 1 from the Oregon fellow if the 1 from the Fifty is no good. You have tried it? is it the 5 wire with the brown B+ sense?
Hows the Fifty wiring harness? Could you swap it and use the Whole system with the 3 phase and R/R?

Oh See is a evil but sexy looking girl, lured ya right in wagging her tail!

Stator #5 is the used one we picked up after discovering Stator #4 had been consumed by that wheeled demon.

Stator #6 is the three-phase stator off of Fitty. It, along with Fitty's rotor (rotor #3) are currently installed on that @#$%^&!!! KZ650, and only making 63 VAC @ 4000 rpm. That combination has not yet been hooked up to any regulator/rectifier. The regulator/rectifier that came off of Fitty (regulator/rectifier #5)has yet to be installed on the bike. It is, by the way, a 5 wire regulator (3 yellow, 1 black, and 1 brown). The brown wire will be hooked up to switched 12v power, when it is hooked up, but I am going to first resolve the stator output issue and the consuming stators issue. Then we'll work on figuring out why it's eating regulator/rectifiers.

As you so eloquently pointed out yesterday, by the time you get to stator #6 and rotor #3, it's time to consider what might be causing those stators to fail. Two years ago, I suggested the same thing, and was hammered. Of course, we were only on stator #3, rotor #2, regulator/rectifier #3 and battery #3 at the time.

Ok so Stator 5 is still a usable part then? It has a output of 70 something ACv at something close to 4000R's?
This is the 1 you had installed and were getting the 13.3-13.6v switching correct? It is the 2 wire single phase stator that fits the bike?
OK so out of curiosity what sort of AMP meter do you have? Does your DVOM have an AMP clamp to go around the Charging output wire from the R/R? Even with a lower voltage threshold, if your current is greater from the charging system than the electrical draw of your system then you should maintain the battery. It would be nice to see a set point of 13.8-14.2 on the R/R, that's basically ideal.
I saw you had done a harness swap already in the past, so maybe I was wrong suggesting the Fifty harness, sorry.
But wiring in the 5 wire R/R with the 3 phase is the way to go. I believe you could use the brown 12v switched/ voltage level sense wire to help check the output of the system. If this is used with say a small 12v light in series to drop the voltage down to the R/R it should then think the battery level is low and increase the output. This how systems end up overcharging and boiling a battery. If this brown wire circuit to the R/R is not a good circuit, ie dirty loose or corroded, it will drop the Voltage in the same manor to the R/R and up the charging output.

Is she still wigglin and gigglin, as she did when you first met her?

if your bike has a mechanical regulator it may be out of adjustment (causing it go ground out power at to low a voltage) in one of my service manuals I have seen a procedure for adjusting it.

On my 550's, I only get 45vAC at 3000 RPM on each pair of yellow wires on the stator. I get about 71vAC at 6000 RPM. I would say 60-something volts at 4000 RPM is doing good.
You now have 3 phases so each one is going to have less than a 1 phase would have.

I also think the AC readings you get on the other stators are fine. Those ACV reading alone would not label them as bad in my opinion. I would ignore the ohm readings as well, as long as they are all close to each other.

Are you saying some of the stators have scratches on the pole pieces? Did they appear after you tried them or before? Have you checked the runout on the rotor? If it wobbles, the rotor can be bent, or the crank can be bent, or the end of the crank may not be square. Run the bike with the stator and cover off and see if the rotors are wobbling.

It is very common for a stator to get bent after a crash, I have at least one bent one. Ebay ones may have been parted from a crash.

When you wire the new 3-phase stator, use all new wires from stator to the reg/rec. Then temporarily run new wires straight from the reg/rec to the battery...black to ground, white/red and brown to the positive.

I've got a hard copy of the FSM from the 550, so if I can get an answer from it for you I will look up info. I will be in and out through the day.


If the brown wire is hooked directly to the B+ batt terminal, wouldn't this cause a current draw after key off?
If not then why is it switched from Kawasaki?
I had some over charging issues on my recent trip, and I did hook this to to battery, but through a relay that is ignition switched. I have now found the culprit, main fuse terminal is overheated again I blew 1 30 amp main after a year and 3000mi. I had replaced the fuse panel from a near perfect used 1 and had cleaned it all up. Hate those glass ones for such a high AMP circuit. I'm going to make some changes before putting it back on the road.

Motor Head wrote:

If the brown wire is hooked directly to the B+ batt terminal, wouldn't this cause a current draw after key off?

Yes, that is why I said "temporarily".

One symptom bikes get if they have the brown wire on the reg/rec is overcharging beacause of voltage drops on the brown wire circuit, as you (Motor Head) said. This is one reason why the coil-relay mod is problematic. It doesn't address the voltage drops in the wiring. This can cause an over-voltage condition on the battery.

Yes, you could theoretically use the brown wire to try to control the regulator, but that assumes the regulator is shunting excess power. It won't work if the regulator is already letting full power go to the battery. (You could use a scope to determine if this is happening. There is no way to tell with a simple volt meter.)

Sean could just leave the brown wire unconnected completely. This should disable the regulator (but the rectifier still works as normal). This will allow full power to go to the battery at all times. He could start the bike, but don't rev the bike until he has a good solid volt meter hooked up to monitor the voltage on the battery. Then rev the bike slowly and WATCH the voltage. Don't let it go above 15v. If it never gates to 14, then there is too much load on the system, or the rotor may be wobbling or even slipping, which does happen, but is rare. (A scope would show this as well.)

He stated and its in his signature, WG coil mod!
I agree it is masking the problem. I've found mine and will do a complete long lasting repair.

Motor Head wrote:

He stated and its in his signature, WG coil mod!
I agree it is masking the problem. I've found mine and will do a complete long lasting repair.

Yes, but in the original reg/rec, there should not have been a brown wire. The sense circuit is internally connected directly to the positive output wire.

The brown wire on the reg/rec uses very very little current. So little, that some reg/recs get away with them connected all the time.

I'm sure he doesn't have a scope, as he said as much. That is why I was asking him about an AMP probe, much more affordable for him.
So if the brown is disconnected completely it goes full output DCv. Good to know, I was thinking it had to have power to it. I've never seen the schematic for the R/R. Do you agree that the 5 wire R/R and 3 phase will be his best solution?
As to his possible scraping between Rotor/ Stator, I wounder if he has a dial indicator he could check run out as well as end play. Again arbor Freight/ "China Tools" is the quickest and pretty cheap source for a AMP clamp and the Indicator/ Stand.

Motor Head wrote:

I'm sure he doesn't have a scope, as he said as much. That is why I was asking him about an AMP probe, much more affordable for him.
So if the brown is disconnected completely it goes full output DCv. Good to know, I was thinking it had to have power to it. I've never seen the schematic for the R/R. Do you agree that the 5 wire R/R and 3 phase will be his best solution?
As to his possible scraping between Rotor/ Stator, I wounder if he has a dial indicator he could check run out as well as end play. Again arbor Freight/ "China Tools" is the quickest and pretty cheap source for a AMP clamp and the Indicator/ Stand.

My point is that somethings can't be seen without a scope. The problem with ammeters and voltmeters is that they don't show fluctutation, they "average" out the voltage. A lot can be seen by looking at the instantaneous voltage. Without it, many things are left to guess work (which is what he is doing). Not that it won't get the job done, but sometimes it takes way longer that way, and is less comforting if the true problem was not known. I don't expect him to get a scope, just saying what I'd do.

Yes, the regulators with external sense lines can be disabled to allow full power output from the rectifier. Here is a schematic I designed, but it's functionally the same as a stock reg/rec. (I don't know the exact circuit of a stock one, it's probably simpler.)
home.comcast.net/~loudgpz/GPZweb/RegRec/GPZvRegMagnetField.html

Yes, I think the 3-phase is a better system overall. Not necessarily more power, but may have a wider RPM range for decent power and also has far less ripple.

Yes great circuit attachment.
As far as a test for him, he should be able to get a reading of his charging AMPs and Volts with either a AMP clamp or even a Cheap in series AMP meter that can handle the output. This is not the DVOM but just a 2 1/8" automotive dash gauge. They sell them at China Tools, he can put this in his red/ white to the battery. Then as you say unplug the Brown and even with the head light on see a + reading. Also using a Volt meter at the same time across the battery to make sure not to exceed 15v, and to see what it is of course.
This is if he uses the "Fifty" stuff.
Whats a way to see full DCv output on the stock R/R on his model? In case he is still playing with stator #????