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1973 Z1 Maui 24 Jul 2022 11:26 #870941

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As I go through looking at everything, including the books and photos, I have noticed one thing that I’m not sure of. The top cam chain gear idler between the cams looks symmetrical. I’ve seen it installed in my books both ways. I marked mine with an arrow upon initial disassembly. What if it’s backwards? I don’t see how it would cause my problem but worth asking.

Cant quite tell but it looks like there is a metal spacer under the center idler. Can you remove that idler and let us see what you have there. I also answered in the Honda forms about using Liska idlers. Also when I blow up the photo it sure looks like some heavy scratches on that pocket for one of the shim buckets. Can you get addition pictures of all those buckets


 

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1973 Z1 Maui 24 Jul 2022 11:37 #870944

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Cant quite tell by your picture of the center Idler but it looks like a steel shim under the idler. Should be rubber on top and bottom. Can you disassemble and show us what you have there. As mentioned before I replace all those idlers with Liska idlers. The Liska center idler uses solid spacers. As one of the other guys posted you run a chance of those stock ones disintegrating. Hardrock can verify that also. When I blew up that picture of the center idler I noticed some pretty heavy scratches on that pocket where the bucket slips into. Can you provide addition photos of the other buckets. I would be looking for those  scratches in the others. Those bores should be super smooth.

I have posted some of this in the Honda forms. I will follow here instead.,

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1973 Z1 Maui 24 Jul 2022 11:49 #870945

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Looking at the center idler it looks like there is a metal shim under the idler. Cant quite tell. Can you disassemble and let us see what you have. As mentioned before I like to replace all of those stock idlers with Liska idlers. Liska uses solid spacers on their center Idler. Those stock units can fail and disintegrate as Hardrock can verify. Also when I blew up the photo there appears to be some major scratches on the cam bucket bore. Those should be super smooth. Can you supply additional photo of the other bores. I would be looking for scratches on those as well.

Sorry for all the posts. I didn't think they worked for the first ones

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Last edit: by Cra-z1.

1973 Z1 Maui 25 Jul 2022 08:45 #870986

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Could this head be warped? Did you bolt in a cam without any parts and spin it in the cam cap bores?
25 years ago I ground off the lobes on a good camshaft. I can use this to spin in bores with the valves in the head. I have mixed caps & head parts for over 40 years.
I also use a Scotch 1" abrasive barrel to clean up the babbit surface on cam bearings to loosen and clean them up.
If you have oil? Them something is binding???
Livin in "CheektaVegas, NY
Went thru 25 of these in 40 yrs.
I SOLD OUT! THE KAW BARN IS EMPTY.
More room for The Old Girl, Harley 75 FLH Electra Glide,
Old faithful! Points ign. Bendix Orig. carb.
Starts everytime!

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1973 Z1 Maui 25 Jul 2022 08:54 #870987

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"Need to figure out how to do something like this. Not compression testing, turning the engine with an external source"

Hey Matt! here is what you do! Get a 22mm APE dragbike external starter nut with a 1-1/8" nut for the end of the small cranks.  Then get a "Real" heavy duty electric impact gun like a Snap-On or Milwaukee. Ryobi might work too. Have no plugs in engine if heads on? Or suspend cam chain if head is off and that gun will crank the engine over fine!   See if oil is flowing! 

Livin in "CheektaVegas, NY
Went thru 25 of these in 40 yrs.
I SOLD OUT! THE KAW BARN IS EMPTY.
More room for The Old Girl, Harley 75 FLH Electra Glide,
Old faithful! Points ign. Bendix Orig. carb.
Starts everytime!

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Last edit: by z1kzonly. Reason: spell check

1973 Z1 Maui 25 Jul 2022 09:35 #870990

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Could this head be warped? Did you bolt in a cam without any parts and spin it in the cam cap bores?
25 years ago I ground off the lobes on a good camshaft. I can use this to spin in bores with the valves in the head. I have mixed caps & head parts for over 40 years.
I also use a Scotch 1" abrasive barrel to clean up the babbit surface on cam bearings to loosen and clean them up.
If you have oil? Them something is binding???

I did way back in this thread suggest a light smear of grease on the cover gasket surface and lay a piece of glass on to see if there is even contact across the whole head (shed engineering !) years ago I has a Ford escort twisted so bad it broke the cam half way along
1982 KZ1000 Ltd

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1973 Z1 Maui 27 Jul 2022 14:59 #871152

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Head is back on with no valves or plugs. Waiting for a gauge. I did a blow test to check that each oiler hole gets flow. Not scientific but it tells me there aren’t any blockages. When the gauge gets here I’ll set up for a spin and flow test.
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1973 Z1 Maui 28 Jul 2022 14:06 #871212

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New test for all,,The feather test !!!  I like it
Afterwards  dont forget to  install cams   and torque  down   and   check clearances and  ease of spinning them

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Mr Turbo Race Kit, MTC 1075 Turbo pistons by PitStop Performance , Falicon Ultra Lite Super Crank, APE everything. Les Holt @ PDM's Billet Goodies . Frame by Chuck Kurzawa @ Logghe Chassis . Deep sump 5qt oil pan. RIP Bill Hahn

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1973 Z1 Maui 28 Jul 2022 14:41 #871213

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Yep, before I put the valves in I’ll do a “free spin” test again
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1973 Z1 Maui 20 Aug 2022 09:07 #872537

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cams and bearings in, no valves. All spun very freely.
spun it with the starter and a strong battery, oil light went out, never budged the pressure gauge needle.
took gauge off, put on a clear tube, spun it again, oil went up tube. I never saw oil at the cams. I took the dynamo cover off and looked down the other end of the gallery, all clear. Pump is either too weak to push oil up or I have a blockage in the cylinders or head that has eluded my many inspections. 

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1973 Z1 Maui 20 Aug 2022 11:12 #872544

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No pressure and less oil flow, definitve a oil pump problem (loose screws) or missing o-ring between the upper and lower engine case.

 

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Last edit: by Scirocco.

1973 Z1 Maui 20 Aug 2022 16:16 #872566

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For info...oil is picked up by the pump and transferred to the filter housing where it is forced through the filter and into the center bolt.  From there it flows up through the bypass valve and into the main gallery where it is distributed to the bearings and up into the head.  As a precaution you might check your filter bolt for any restriction.

I think somewhere in the thread you mentioned disassembling the pump and checking clearances and they were all good.  My guess then is a missing O ring.  There's one under the pump that can be checked relatively easily.  There's another on the oil system near the middle of the cases that the book mentions to not forget.  See photos.



I have several restored bikes along with a 2006 Goldwing with a sidecar. My wife has a 2019 Suzuki DR 650 for on and off road.
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