KZP engine rebuild

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20 Aug 2016 06:59 #739285 by ThatGPzGuy
Replied by ThatGPzGuy on topic KZP engine rebuild
No. I will clean the entire block today and load it up into my son's CJ tomorrow. Hopefully I can drop it off sometime Monday night.
My machinist has the jugs, pistons and cylinder head but hasn't touched them yet.

Jim
North GA
2016 Yamaha FJR1300ES
1982 GPz750 R1
1974 Kawasaki H1
1976 Kawasaki KZ400
1979 Yamaha XS650 cafe'
2001 KZ1000P
2001 Yamaha YZ426
1981 Honda XR200 stroked in an '89 CR125 chassis
1965 Mustang
1967 Triumph GT6
1976 Bronco
"If you didn't build it, it's not really yours"

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20 Aug 2016 07:37 #739288 by SWest
Replied by SWest on topic KZP engine rebuild
Your welder can take his air grinder tip and have it prepped in 5 minutes. I have a bit that EATS aluminum like the one I used on my sprocket cover. It's just a bit you can put into a router or drill. The welds will be denser than the cast so I doubt there will be ANY leaks. I laughed at the previous comment. :lol: Miller had his barrels built up around the jugs when he had 1015 sleeves installed in his 750 Honda. B) The aluminum was so thin oil would seep through the metal. Dennis built up the areas and cured that issue. ;) I would bring both pieces, bolt them together and have it welded from the outside first. From what I've seen it doesn't look too bad. :)
Steve

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18 Mar 2017 19:12 #757067 by ThatGPzGuy
Replied by ThatGPzGuy on topic KZP engine rebuild
Well, here's an update and a request for help.
The cases were welded, jugs bored, new .050 over IMD pistons fitted, head refurbished, new cam chain guides installed, and everything put back together with new gaskets and seals. Valve clearances were adjusted.
Here are the issues:
Runs like crap. It starts but it took cranking the idle screw pretty far in to get it to idle. All headers heat up although it seems 2 and 3 heat a little slower than one and four, I didn't touch the carbs other than a good cleaning. It doesn't make any weird noises. I did a compression check and got 120, 90, 90, 120 which I attributed to a cold engine with non-seated rings.
I thought the carbs might be out of sync but I can hardly get a vacuum signal and actually get air pushing out of the carb nipple!
The oil pressure is also very low (<3 PSI) and I can feel air pushing out of the oil fill. I didn't have the oil pressure gauge installed before the rebuild so I don't know if the oil pressure was low before (but the light never came on).
Trying to think back what I might have done wrong and the only thing I can think of is maybe I'm off a tooth on the cam chain.
I put a timing light on it and the marks line up for 1-4.
Not sure where to go here except maybe pull the valve cover and check the cams again.

Jim
North GA
2016 Yamaha FJR1300ES
1982 GPz750 R1
1974 Kawasaki H1
1976 Kawasaki KZ400
1979 Yamaha XS650 cafe'
2001 KZ1000P
2001 Yamaha YZ426
1981 Honda XR200 stroked in an '89 CR125 chassis
1965 Mustang
1967 Triumph GT6
1976 Bronco
"If you didn't build it, it's not really yours"

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19 Mar 2017 06:51 #757103 by SWest
Replied by SWest on topic KZP engine rebuild
I'd check the cam timing. The large fours have low oil pressure so 3psi is good. The air coming out of the filler sounds like blowby. It should go away if the bike is running as it should. Compression should come up too.
Steve
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27 Jun 2017 15:28 #765528 by ThatGPzGuy
Replied by ThatGPzGuy on topic KZP engine rebuild
Still fighting this.
Steve was right about the cams being off a tooth. Fixed that.
It starts easily, doesn't make any weird noises, idles OK. It has very little power below 3K but will pull from there until 5K all right but not great. It still feels "off".
I swapped in my GPz750 carbs which are working great in the GPz but there was no change when I ran them on the cop bike.
I did a compression check and a leak down and there are no issues there. The exhaust pipes heat up fairly evenly. I replaced the coils with Dyna units.
I keep coming back to timing but it looks fine. Here is the timing pointer:
[IMG

The exhaust cam:
[IMG

[IMG

There are 44 pins between the arrows and the notches on the cams on the right are opposed. Not sure what else I could be missing.

Jim
North GA
2016 Yamaha FJR1300ES
1982 GPz750 R1
1974 Kawasaki H1
1976 Kawasaki KZ400
1979 Yamaha XS650 cafe'
2001 KZ1000P
2001 Yamaha YZ426
1981 Honda XR200 stroked in an '89 CR125 chassis
1965 Mustang
1967 Triumph GT6
1976 Bronco
"If you didn't build it, it's not really yours"
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28 Jun 2017 09:43 #765582 by daveo
Replied by daveo on topic KZP engine rebuild
Is the cam chain length within spec?

1982 KZ1100-A2

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  • ThatGPzGuy
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29 Jun 2017 14:15 #765678 by ThatGPzGuy
Replied by ThatGPzGuy on topic KZP engine rebuild
Sadly, No. Just measured and I get 129.8mm My Clymer manual says it should be 128.9mm.
But is that enough to cause these problems? It was running fine before I tore it down to fix the oil leak and do the top end.

Jim
North GA
2016 Yamaha FJR1300ES
1982 GPz750 R1
1974 Kawasaki H1
1976 Kawasaki KZ400
1979 Yamaha XS650 cafe'
2001 KZ1000P
2001 Yamaha YZ426
1981 Honda XR200 stroked in an '89 CR125 chassis
1965 Mustang
1967 Triumph GT6
1976 Bronco
"If you didn't build it, it's not really yours"

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29 Jun 2017 16:25 - 29 Jun 2017 21:08 #765686 by daveo
Replied by daveo on topic KZP engine rebuild

ThatGPzGuy wrote: Sadly, No. Just measured and I get 129.8mm My Clymer manual says it should be 128.9mm.
But is that enough to cause these problems? It was running fine before I tore it down to fix the oil leak and do the top end.



Not sure how significant, but considering how many times that measurement is repeated over the length of the chain, it would likely affect the crank/cam and cam/cam timing.
The chain may also be stretched-out more in some areas, which would also have an effect on operational consistency.

Kawasaki cop bikes are cool, but one must admit that few were given the worthy respect they deserved. A lesser engine would have blown sky-high just trying to endure the constant stress those engines were subjected to. :pinch:
I used the head from one of them for a short time. A dropped exhaust guide and several stripped out 6mm bolt holes were proof enough, not to mention the warp it had when I got it.

1982 KZ1100-A2

Last edit: 29 Jun 2017 21:08 by daveo.
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30 Jun 2017 15:25 #765776 by ThatGPzGuy
Replied by ThatGPzGuy on topic KZP engine rebuild
Yes, this one does show some abuse/misfortune in it's past. The head was warped but not too badly. The valve guides and valves were fine and just needed a cleanup and new seals.
I always thought these Hyvo chains were good to go for a good, long time. I would hate to tear this thing down again just to find that wasn't the problem. But since I can't ride it as is...
I might park it for a while and work on some other projects. Darn.
Thanks daveo

Jim
North GA
2016 Yamaha FJR1300ES
1982 GPz750 R1
1974 Kawasaki H1
1976 Kawasaki KZ400
1979 Yamaha XS650 cafe'
2001 KZ1000P
2001 Yamaha YZ426
1981 Honda XR200 stroked in an '89 CR125 chassis
1965 Mustang
1967 Triumph GT6
1976 Bronco
"If you didn't build it, it's not really yours"
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30 Jun 2017 16:17 #765785 by daveo
Replied by daveo on topic KZP engine rebuild
Please don't base a difficult decision on one potentially erroneous suggestion. Any opinion should be supported or impugned by other members with significantly more experience and knowledge having dealt with such things.

;)

1982 KZ1100-A2

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01 Jul 2017 08:39 #765834 by ThatGPzGuy
Replied by ThatGPzGuy on topic KZP engine rebuild
No worries daveo. I am going to keep asking for advice and see what I can figure out. I might take the cams out again and reinstall.

Jim
North GA
2016 Yamaha FJR1300ES
1982 GPz750 R1
1974 Kawasaki H1
1976 Kawasaki KZ400
1979 Yamaha XS650 cafe'
2001 KZ1000P
2001 Yamaha YZ426
1981 Honda XR200 stroked in an '89 CR125 chassis
1965 Mustang
1967 Triumph GT6
1976 Bronco
"If you didn't build it, it's not really yours"

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12 Jul 2017 16:38 - 12 Jul 2017 16:56 #766798 by ThatGPzGuy
Replied by ThatGPzGuy on topic KZP engine rebuild
Hey All,
One last plea for ideas. I need to move on from this project. I would love to get this going but it's just not working out. I honestly don't know where to go with this so I am just going to put it back together and shove it in a corner for a while. I need to get the H1 going and I have some work to do on the café bike.
Any last things ideas to try will be welcome...
Oh, and F... Photobucket.

Jim
North GA
2016 Yamaha FJR1300ES
1982 GPz750 R1
1974 Kawasaki H1
1976 Kawasaki KZ400
1979 Yamaha XS650 cafe'
2001 KZ1000P
2001 Yamaha YZ426
1981 Honda XR200 stroked in an '89 CR125 chassis
1965 Mustang
1967 Triumph GT6
1976 Bronco
"If you didn't build it, it's not really yours"
Last edit: 12 Jul 2017 16:56 by ThatGPzGuy.

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