What Oil Do You Run?

baldy110 wrote: Unicorn blood, oil is a hotly debated subject.

Told ya so.

Nessism wrote:

redhawk4 wrote:

bountyhunter wrote:

redhawk4 wrote: I understand from a few things I've read that in an engine that shares it's oil with the transmission, the gearbox actually shears and breaks down the oil far more rapidly than the engine ever would and this is another reason to use the appropriate oils for the application. Again diesel oils are good because they are designed to endure a tougher environment and engines with the oil operated injectors also are very hard on the oil shearing it to a lower viscosity level quite rapidly from a 40 weight starting point.

Yep, it is the VI's (viscosity increasers) that get the shearing effect from the gearbox. VI's are not oil, they are additives. A 10-40 oil is made by taking 10W oil and adding enough VI's until the viscosity is the same as a 40W would have at 100C temp. As the VI's break down, the 10-40 goes to 10-30...... then 10-20.... then just 10W. While companies talk about how great syn oil is.... the additive package is not synthetic and some are better than others.

Another point: the base oil (mineral or syn) almost never breaks down but the additives fall apart or get used up quite often and can really cause damage..... hence the wisdom of changing before service limit.

That is one advantage to using a straight weight oil because a straight 40w will stay at that weight for much longer, as you say, because it's the VI's that break down, but then a Mutigrade has so many other benefits, for cold starts etc. That is one reason not to overly extend oil change intervals, where even though the oil may look relatively clean, it may not be performing as it should any longer. As we get more extremes in multigrades like 5/40 then this break down can become more significant, because they are starting out with a 5w and beefing it up.

Straight weight oils come in various viscosity levels, the most popular of which are 30, 40, 50. Note: these weights are not 30W, 40W, 50W, which do not exist. The W indicates a Winter viscosity rating, and the only straight weight W rated oils are 0W, 5W, 10W, 15W, 20W, 25W.

Straight weight oils are commonly labelled as SAE 50W etc. so while I understand the W is for winter there are nonetheless oils referred to as 40W and 50W even if that may be technically incorrect.

Another factor to consider with oil for Motorcycles is internal corrosion. One of the things emphasized by the manufacturers in the different additive packages they use in Motorcycle oils is that they recognize the different way in which motorcycles are often used compared to a car and that is that most are used occasionally and that there will be long periods when they will be sitting unused. As a result they use more corrosion inhibitors in the oil. Coincidentally again this is a strength of diesel engine oils since that too is a corrosive environment much more so than a gas powered engine so they too contain more corrosion inhibitors.

undiablo wrote: I had a HEUI Caterpillar Engine. Man... I got tired of changing injectors. When the warranty was over, a CAT technician told me: "stop using CAT oil. They buy it bulk to some low quality manufacturer and just stick the CAT label, go heavy duty diesel synthetic oil from any good company and you will never have another HEUI injector failure again".
I trusted that guy so much I gave it a try. Guess what? I sold the truck with over 200k miles and no more failing HEUI injectors. :woohoo:

redhawk4 wrote:

car5car wrote:

redhawk4 wrote: oil operated injectors t.

What are you talking about? Oil operated injectors???????????

HEUI injectors use a high pressure oil feed from a High Pressure Oil Pump to operate the fuel injector with electronics to control the amount of fuel injected and timing etc. Designed by Caterpillar, they are commonly used on International truck engines and so are in many of the Ford Power Stroke pickup motors made by International. At idle the High Pressure Oil Pump provides a pressure of about 580 psi but at higher engine speeds the pressure is as high as 3,000 psi or higher. They are now an outdated technology, but were state of the art in the early 90's when direct injection first came into production as opposed to the old style indirect injection operating from a mechanical fuel pump.

Look it up, if you still think I'm talking crap.

The choice of oil is important with those injectors, synthetic oils are popularly recommended to stop them failing. You also have to be careful of the oil change interval because of way they shear the oil and also they cannot tolerate dirty oil because of the very small tolerances involved.

swest wrote: When I bought my daughter 04 Malibu I put in Castrol GTX 20/50. I swore by that oil. She took it in for a recall and they put in 5/30 shelf brand oil. A month later there was no oil in it. I bought new Castrol and a filter, put it in. She told be "they" said it's the wrong oil for that car. I told her "they" are happy to sell her oil that will evaporate so she will buy a new car when this one burns out. It has over 150,000 miles on it so thin oil won't he enough for it. I told her about my experience with the new Castrol and how it went away too fast. I put in Rotilla and haven't had to add oil in over 500 miles. She barked at me if I wanted to use different oil she would give me the car and I could do what I want with it. " Fine, when your car dies, I don't want to hear about it." :whistle:
Steve

I have a 96 Mercury Cougar that I picked up cheap at the Dealer Auctions, with low miles and one elderly previous owner. It makes for a great daily driver keeping the miles off my more expensive vehicles. I took it for an oil change the other day at a place I used to frequent, but that has changed ownership. I noticed a few days later they put a 5/20 oil in it!!!! I have yet to have the opportunity to return and discuss this, but if that is the oil they are putting in everyone's cars, there are going to be a lot of people whose engines will not thank them, especially as the warmer weather is on the way and who are suddenly going to find they are using a lot of oil, assuming they get round to checking it in time.

Definitely with high mileage engines that have some wear, a higher viscosity oil will likely have benefits, in the same way that the larger tolerances of air cooled motors require the 40, 50 and in some cases even 60 weights. I too have noticed on some older and higher mileage cars and trucks that oil consumption is reduced quite substantially between a 10/30 and 10 or 15/40

redhawk4 wrote: Straight weight oils are commonly labelled as SAE 50W etc. so while I understand the W is for winter there are nonetheless oils referred to as 40W and 50W even if that may be technically incorrect.

I just went to a bunch of different oil makers websites and can't find any reference to 40W or 50W. Got a link?

I would never use a single weight oil in a car or bike. The increased wear during cold start up running would be severe. "10-40" is stamped on the oil filler cap on KZ's for a reason.

As for idiots putting 5-20 in older cars and bikes: yes they are, because we have a unique problem with oil. The newer service grades like SN and newer are NOT SAFE to use in older cars and bikes but oil makers are not talking about it. So people just buy new oil and don't know any better. The new CAFE fuel economy mandates have new car makers holding tight tolerances in their engines and running oil as thin as mineral spirits and claiming it's all good...... But these are the same people who reduced zinc levels to about nothing and claimed it wouldn't hurt engine life.

Nessism wrote:

redhawk4 wrote: Straight weight oils are commonly labelled as SAE 50W etc. so while I understand the W is for winter there are nonetheless oils referred to as 40W and 50W even if that may be technically incorrect.

I just went to a bunch of different oil makers websites and can't find any reference to 40W or 50W. Got a link?

Here is 40W:

www.grainger.com/product/FORMULA-SHELL-M...3GP28_AS01?$smthumb$



50W:

shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/valvoline-vr...uart-vv235/8020450-P

Nessism wrote:

redhawk4 wrote: Straight weight oils are commonly labelled as SAE 50W etc. so while I understand the W is for winter there are nonetheless oils referred to as 40W and 50W even if that may be technically incorrect.

I just went to a bunch of different oil makers websites and can't find any reference to 40W or 50W. Got a link?

jet.com/product/detail/9b84af671ada488d9...m1tdaSy_8aAqWN8P8HAQ

www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/search/Conven...+50W/N0429/C0162.oap

Any internet search will pull up endless such references, doesn't mean it's correct, but that's what it's commonly described as, which was my point.

bountyhunter wrote: I would never use a single weight oil in a car or bike. The increased wear during cold start up running would be severe. "10-40" is stamped on the oil filler cap on KZ's for a reason.

As for idiots putting 5-20 in older cars and bikes: yes they are, because we have a unique problem with oil. The newer service grades like SN and newer are NOT SAFE to use in older cars and bikes but oil makers are not talking about it. So people just buy new oil and don't know any better. The new CAFE fuel economy mandates have new car makers holding tight tolerances in their engines and running oil as thin as mineral spirits and claiming it's all good...... But these are the same people who reduced zinc levels to about nothing and claimed it wouldn't hurt engine life.

The place I got mine done is a Castrol lube center, I'd be interested to know what Castrol think of it. Unfortunately even as pissed off as I am they did it, my life is such at the moment that it's not figuring too high on my list of people who need a new "double wide one" ripping, so it will have to wait for another day - they say bad luck comes in threes, apparently general crap and the effects of dealing with the incompetent, apparently know, no such bounds - typed while waiting for a couple of phone calls to be returned concerning other cock ups.

They've made it clear they don't want older machines on the road for whatever reason. :dry:
Steve

swest wrote: They've made it clear they don't want older machines on the road for whatever reason. :dry:
Steve

They know you are responsible for all the Smog in CA and melting polar icecaps every time you start Bossie up

Well I called Castrol and had to sort of eat some Humble pie because apparently Ford Brought out some technical bulletin saying to run 5/20 in 4.6 V8 motors right back to 97, many years ago. Still sounds like some pseudo global warming EPA type of scam putting Ford in a better light with their CAFE stuff than being anything to do with what is actually good for your vehicle, given when it was built they said 5/30 with 10/40 as an option for hot weather. It's supposed to improve fuel mileage running a 5/20. I will continue with 5/30 for winter and 10/40 for summer when normal service is resumed. In all the years I've had various vehicles serviced with this engine, I've never had anyone put a 5/20 in given the TSB came out in 2001 - mind you not many places have even had 5/20 until relatively recently.

Aughhh. Those poor polar bears. :lol:
They wanted to ban 10 year and older cars and trucks until there was a outcry. My 69 Ford F 250 gets 20 mpg on the HWY. It runs regular fuel and I can go up the grape vine fully loaded, towing a trailer at 65 MPH. The only time I had the drop down to 2nd was when I had my grandmother's 75 240D Mercedies on my dolly pulling the grade. Felt like a anchor. I'll keep the truck thank you and Bossie.
Steve