KZR Chicago Chapter.

I have been trying for a long time to get old kaws together so we can all graze on the field. I'm in for sure. I know of three or more people who would be in too. I have a 79 kz1000 stock cept dyna ignition, coils, 29 smoothies and bigger rear gear and one smaller in the front. I have started to put some money in it.

I just have to find out what size engine for the street to go so I can not have to worry about melting her down each and every time I ride. Any ideas? This mechanic I have known for 21 years who used to race these bikes seems to think that a low compression 1428 would be the ticket and APE racing thinks that perhaps a 1327 kit would work as long as I don't get stuck in stop and go traffic. I would greatly appreciate feedback from anyone who has experience with the chicago streets to help me out. I will be spending a stupid amount of money on this bike just to have to rebuild it later because of overheating issues. Another guy says that a 1075 kit is best and you won't have to worry about the overheating issue. I want to get the most out of the engine without having to worry about destroying it the first time I get on it. I would like to ride it to California or any long ride so I am stumped as to what gives the best and is reasonably reliable. www.saxnu1@hotmail.com I have all summer free to ride so how about it?

I personally wouldn’t go any larger than a 1197. This is the larges you can go in the stock cylinder block and that way keep all of your cooling advantages. Mount the largest oil cooler you can on it also. Don't go too radical on the cams either. Try to keep the sleeve thickness at least .08" (2mm) You would find out the hard way that a big block would be nothing but trouble on a typical Chicago summer day.

otakar

You are 100% RIGHT. 1197 is as big as I would go for the street.
A big block will not cool the center cylinders, no air passages between cylinders. O sure I have taken a big block out on the street for a quick spin.
I know several guys that have dun it. (We all said the same thing)
THERES A FIRE DOWN BELOW (grin)
If I could afford new pistons and block every 50 miles Id do it all the time.

If I were going to build a hot rod I build a 1105 for the street,
Then when it go's south you can bore or resleeve. If you build a 1197
you are stuck with it. Thats as big as you can go with a stock block......


XENU

I have a 1103 kit in one of my Z1-Rs and it gets pretty hot due to the cylinder walls only being about .05" thick. I would only go to a 1075 with the stock sleeves. I believe that .08" is the minimum amount of iron required for decent heat transfer to the aluminum block. This is why I would just go ahead and do the full sleeve replacement right off the bat.

Alright guys. Thanks for the advice! 1197 it is. I have 29s I assume they might be a little on the small side? 34 flatsides would be right for this? I talked to Mark Smit a bike mechanic I have known since I was 16 twenty three years ago. He mentioned many options to me. He too said something like 1102-20 something like that.
Otto, I would love to check out those bikes of yours sometime. Another guy in Lama that I ride with has a kaw and I just found out he has 1197 with what he said two stage miks. I have absolutely no idea what two stage carbs are but I like his bike. I have to get going on this project before I lose time riding. Once I get the engine done and frame powder coated I am going to get the paint and a gunfighter and lady saddle she should look pretty good after that. I will take plenty of pics too. I really enjoyed the pics you put up of your bike. I give you much respect. You are like McGyver or something on bikes. lol I wish I had some skills so that I could paint and put the bike engine together myself. Besides that it is a good thing I probably would be able to save a bit of money. I think though I will just stick to playin my sax and let the real skilled help me out.

But wait... you said that a 1261 kit would work with a gpz head and block? Would this be a good streetable combo? I want as big as I can get away with using as a daily rider. Thanks Otto

Yes a 1261 can be shoe-horned into a stock block. But I just did the math and things are getting quite thin in places. I think that heat would most likely be a problem with some of the Chicago hot days we have in the summers. I think for reliability I am going to stick with the 1197. After all, if you are going to spend $1200 just on the block and pistons you want it to be rideable to and from work every day. The 7 or eight extra horse you may or may not get in the extra 65cc is not worth the risk. I actually decided to go in the other direction and go with a 1135 kit for now. I want to be able to put 50,000 on this without problem. I do 10,000 a year to and from work and that is just on the bike. From Burr ridge to Lake Zurich is over 40 mi one way and I ride every day the temp is over 38*f. I plan on getting the horse power with a tricked out 84 GPZ head and a set of hot cams and carbs. I should still be able to get into the mid to lower Tens and a top end of about 160 is more than enough. I figure 145-155 Horsepower.

Alright! That sounds awesome. I will be putting this summer 5k in less than two weeks. We are planning a Mexico trip. I will be doing quite a bit of riding even long distance for most of it. So I don't want to have problems especially if I am more than 2k away from my house. If you can get away for two weeks you are more than welcome to join us. 2nd and 3rd week of Aug.

So I will get a gpz head and block and take it from there. Those are superior to the kz heads so everyone says. Going to send the crank to Falicon to get indexed and welded and the gears I will send out to get undercut. Make that bottom end bullet proof. So hopefully by mid late April I will have a bike to ride. Then for the paint...I can put some mild cams in it. Huge oil cooler. There are so many great ideas floating around this site. I love it! It had never occurred to me to route the oil cooler above the engine. Add to that using aluminum tubing... great stuff.
Getting on to a group ride one of my buddies owns a mk II and (he actually has two of them) he doesn't have a traditional job unless you call landlord one of them so he has much free time to do whatever he pleases. My sisters co worker has a kz900 and I know a few guys more that ride. I met another guy name Ian who hase a kz said he would totally be interested in riding as a group so I am sure we will have some numbers to terrorize the streets with this summer. Especially with open pipes and worked engines.......

OK; Let me get this straight. I believe you are working on a 79 KZ1000. You can definitely go with the 83-84 GPZ head using the APE chain guide. But, you will have to stay with the earlier cylinder block or go with a big block (bad idea) the later "J" series cylinders will not work on your cases with out major heartache just stay with your block and re-sleeve with a set of KA629sl sleeves and than punch to 1135 or 1197 (maximum). Would stay with the 1135. With the GPZ head you will have to go to a piston which is about two points higher in compression than you want to wind up with. This is due to the larger combustion chamber in the new head. This means going with 13.5:1 pistons to get 11.5:1 compression. You should still knock off one more compression point somewhere to get down to about 10-10.5:1 just so you can run pump gas. Otherwise you will have to stop at airports to buy 100LL Av Gas.

Post edited by: otakar, at: 2008/02/01 19:20

I just want to mention that next week is the “Chicago International Motorcycle Show” at the Rosemont Expo Center next to O’Hare airport. I plan on going Friday night after work. This will be the first time that I have gone in over twenty years.

Thanks Otto. I guess there is quite alot to think about. 1135 so that if I need to later I can always go to the next size when rebuilding? Well I have to find a head first so as soon as I get the engine out and send everything out I will get back to you and let you know how things are going. 34s are probably the best set up? What about the cams how big? This is a great help to me. I was going to order the 1327 big bore kit and cam set from APE. I am really glad I waited.
Do you think that my 29s would be good for that setup? Someone told me that I can take them and get them bored to 33s something I don't even want to think about really because if it's not done right not only do they not work but I have essentially junked a really nice set of old school carbs. Besides my ignorance on carb design I would think that doing something like that is a cheap fix when I could just sell the carbs and put that towards a new set of carbs. I left you a message on your phone yesterday so if and when you would like maybe we can meet up to talk and you can show me some pics of your bikes. The motorcycle show sounds like the right time and place. Im looking forward to it.

As For carburetors; the SB34 carbs which the later Kawasakis came with are pretty good carbs. They are very efficient and should give the motor plenty of air. Also the 33SB which everyone seams to be knocking are also very good if jetted properly. And last of all, there is absolutely nothing wrong with the 29SBs you have. They will give you reliable performance and plenty of power everywhere you want it or need it. I would not discount them so Quickly as you are doing. Also don’t throw all of your eggs into one basket by sending everything to APE. There is also Cavanaugh Performance, MTC, Pit Stop Performance and alike, they all do good work. For cams I would use the Web Cam #110 grind, especially if you are planning on taking this thing across the country. If you go much bigger, you risk extra “ware and tare” on the top end and having to stop every 100mi for gas. The trick is to do all the right things to your head. I would take a “J” series head and send it to Cavanaugh Racing and have them do a Stage 2 job on it. Now you can go with the standard Wiseco K1135 kit and save a lot of hart ache. I will call you today (Saturday) and we can talk. Here is the link for C.R. www.flowbenchtech.com/porting/CRH/pricing.htm