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KZombie
- wrenchmonkey
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- wrenchmonkey
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05 Jul 2016 08:28 #733960
by wrenchmonkey
Replied by wrenchmonkey on topic KZombie
Greetings Gents,
Hope y'all had a wonderful and relaxing holiday weekend
An update to let y'all know the status of KZombie. I think I found the culprit to the non-starting engine. After the last test with the resulting fuel dripping from the carb mounts (all 4 dripped) I knew I had to pull the carbs but I confirmed all the ignition wiring first and discovered that it was all correct from points thru coils to plugs. I confirmed plugs arcing after replacing them with the correct B7ES and also that my points were arcing during rotation. So this kinda' pointed to the fuel side of the equation as the likely culprit.
Got the carbs pulled and on the bench, I tore them completely down.
Completely = every screw, jet, o-ring, gasket until four piles of not-further-dismantleable resulted.
I discovered almost immediately that my last carb "rebuild" - 10 years ago - turned out to be basically, just cleaning all the bowls :blush:
That's the sucky part about getting old and having CRS (Can't Remember Shit) syndrome. I was sure I rebuilt them not just wiped the dust off, replaced the rubber o-rings and cleaned out the bowls.
Anyway, I started with carb #1 and dismantled, cleaned it viciously, confirming every jet and orifice was perfect then reassembled it then on to carb #2 and so on.
I got to carb #3 and discovered that the small jet (pilot jet) had been sheared - there were no edges for the screwdriver to grip - and I couldn't remove it. I F'd with this one carb most of the day, trying to figure out a way to get it backed out. Worse, the jet was plugged-up and I couldn't get it cleared, if I decided to leave it and continue on. I was working on this carb, trying to clean the jet in situ with some stripped, stranded copper wire and maybe it was the heat/humidity or maybe it was just bumbling clumsiness but I dropped the carb body off the bench! This resulted in a float tower/stanchion breaking at it's base :pinch:
I put it down and went on to carb #4 which went the same as #1 and #2 - smoothly. Cleaning everything fastidiously and reassembling.
I decided I would try to solder the broken #3 float stanchion as it had been discussed previously in another thread - ways to fix borked float bowl over-flow tubes... Problem was my soldering iron isn't big enough to generate the kinda' heat needed to solder such a big piece or area, so I resorted to using a torch. This was a big mistake. I had lightly filed and rubbed flux over the two halves and when I waved the torch's flame over the tower for a couple of seconds with the solder poised to "weld", the tower suddenly swelled-up and distorted. Fortunately, I had put the float's pin through the bores on both towers (to hold the broken one in place for soldering) but the heat caused the pot metal to swell in all directions - outwardly - and this cocked the pin upward to the broken side, jamming the pin inside it. :ohmy: :S
Like I said, I spent most of the day messing with #3 carburetor as a result but final conclusion:
The carb body is shot.
I can't save it.
I cleared the bench and covered the 3 remaning, cleaned and ready for assembly carbs. Went inside, dejected in failure and frustrated beyond belief at how one split second of clumsiness resulted in hours of dinking about to try and fix a lost cause.
I got on the internet and started hunting down VM24SS carb parts. Almost entirely futile unless I wanted to spend somewhere over $150 for sets that looked worse the wear and all just for one of the carbs in the bank. Then I spent hours here on the forum searching for alternatives to these archaic carbs and though I did find some useful options via a link to the 650 forum, none of the options presented direct, no-modification-required results.
The net result:
Carb #3 body is trashed with broken float stanchion and permanently installed (and plugged-up) pilot jet.
I finally found an eBay item that was buy it now and was actually carb #3 and ordered it. I also ordered 4 rebuild kits so I would have the missing pilot jet for it (the #3 carb body on eBay was stripped bare with nothing but the body). So at some point in the next couple of weeks I may be able to get the bank of carbs reassembled and installed back into the bike and be back to starting it.
In the interim I received the new primary cup for the rear master cylinder which developed a leak (just sitting there, no activity or use) and got the rear master cylinder out, new primary cup installed, reassembled and rear caliper bled. Some success to soothe the raw nerves caused by the carb fiasco.
Hope y'all had a wonderful and relaxing holiday weekend
An update to let y'all know the status of KZombie. I think I found the culprit to the non-starting engine. After the last test with the resulting fuel dripping from the carb mounts (all 4 dripped) I knew I had to pull the carbs but I confirmed all the ignition wiring first and discovered that it was all correct from points thru coils to plugs. I confirmed plugs arcing after replacing them with the correct B7ES and also that my points were arcing during rotation. So this kinda' pointed to the fuel side of the equation as the likely culprit.
Got the carbs pulled and on the bench, I tore them completely down.
Completely = every screw, jet, o-ring, gasket until four piles of not-further-dismantleable resulted.
I discovered almost immediately that my last carb "rebuild" - 10 years ago - turned out to be basically, just cleaning all the bowls :blush:
That's the sucky part about getting old and having CRS (Can't Remember Shit) syndrome. I was sure I rebuilt them not just wiped the dust off, replaced the rubber o-rings and cleaned out the bowls.
Anyway, I started with carb #1 and dismantled, cleaned it viciously, confirming every jet and orifice was perfect then reassembled it then on to carb #2 and so on.
I got to carb #3 and discovered that the small jet (pilot jet) had been sheared - there were no edges for the screwdriver to grip - and I couldn't remove it. I F'd with this one carb most of the day, trying to figure out a way to get it backed out. Worse, the jet was plugged-up and I couldn't get it cleared, if I decided to leave it and continue on. I was working on this carb, trying to clean the jet in situ with some stripped, stranded copper wire and maybe it was the heat/humidity or maybe it was just bumbling clumsiness but I dropped the carb body off the bench! This resulted in a float tower/stanchion breaking at it's base :pinch:
I put it down and went on to carb #4 which went the same as #1 and #2 - smoothly. Cleaning everything fastidiously and reassembling.
I decided I would try to solder the broken #3 float stanchion as it had been discussed previously in another thread - ways to fix borked float bowl over-flow tubes... Problem was my soldering iron isn't big enough to generate the kinda' heat needed to solder such a big piece or area, so I resorted to using a torch. This was a big mistake. I had lightly filed and rubbed flux over the two halves and when I waved the torch's flame over the tower for a couple of seconds with the solder poised to "weld", the tower suddenly swelled-up and distorted. Fortunately, I had put the float's pin through the bores on both towers (to hold the broken one in place for soldering) but the heat caused the pot metal to swell in all directions - outwardly - and this cocked the pin upward to the broken side, jamming the pin inside it. :ohmy: :S
Like I said, I spent most of the day messing with #3 carburetor as a result but final conclusion:
The carb body is shot.
I can't save it.
I cleared the bench and covered the 3 remaning, cleaned and ready for assembly carbs. Went inside, dejected in failure and frustrated beyond belief at how one split second of clumsiness resulted in hours of dinking about to try and fix a lost cause.
I got on the internet and started hunting down VM24SS carb parts. Almost entirely futile unless I wanted to spend somewhere over $150 for sets that looked worse the wear and all just for one of the carbs in the bank. Then I spent hours here on the forum searching for alternatives to these archaic carbs and though I did find some useful options via a link to the 650 forum, none of the options presented direct, no-modification-required results.
The net result:
Carb #3 body is trashed with broken float stanchion and permanently installed (and plugged-up) pilot jet.
I finally found an eBay item that was buy it now and was actually carb #3 and ordered it. I also ordered 4 rebuild kits so I would have the missing pilot jet for it (the #3 carb body on eBay was stripped bare with nothing but the body). So at some point in the next couple of weeks I may be able to get the bank of carbs reassembled and installed back into the bike and be back to starting it.
In the interim I received the new primary cup for the rear master cylinder which developed a leak (just sitting there, no activity or use) and got the rear master cylinder out, new primary cup installed, reassembled and rear caliper bled. Some success to soothe the raw nerves caused by the carb fiasco.
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- 650mod
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06 Jul 2016 05:32 #734037
by 650mod
78 kz 650 custom
Wiseco 720cc big bore
Dynajet stage 3 carb kit with pods
2002 Kawasaki Z750 exhaust
2001 Buell lightning front end
1999 Ninja 600 swingarm with 1999 Ninja 900 rear rim
converted to monoshock rear
Too many goodies to list fully
Replied by 650mod on topic KZombie
It's all in the fun of the game wrench 
at least it's something small like that. When I was rebuilding mine, I was just about to get it safeties and on the road... and my starter clutch gave up the ghost... now that was a royal PITA if you ask me. The ONE thing that I needed the most goes.... yeah, it could be kicked over, but...
You're getting there! Awesome work!
Devin
at least it's something small like that. When I was rebuilding mine, I was just about to get it safeties and on the road... and my starter clutch gave up the ghost... now that was a royal PITA if you ask me. The ONE thing that I needed the most goes.... yeah, it could be kicked over, but...You're getting there! Awesome work!
Devin
78 kz 650 custom
Wiseco 720cc big bore
Dynajet stage 3 carb kit with pods
2002 Kawasaki Z750 exhaust
2001 Buell lightning front end
1999 Ninja 600 swingarm with 1999 Ninja 900 rear rim
converted to monoshock rear
Too many goodies to list fully
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- Byron Shasta McNasty Livermore
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