7th Gear Designs

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20 Sep 2024 06:57 #904484 by Nessism
Replied by Nessism on topic 7th Gear Designs
Detonation on deceleration?  Are you sure?  I've never heard of such a thing.

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20 Sep 2024 07:35 #904486 by Nerdy
Replied by Nerdy on topic 7th Gear Designs

Detonation on deceleration?  Are you sure?  I've never heard of such a thing.
 

I believe Feanor is from Spain and not a native speaker of English. I think he meant that there is backfiring on deceleration, which would be an easy mistake to make.

1979 KZ400 Gifted to a couple of nephews
1967 Yamaha YCS1 Bonanza
1980 KZ440B
1981 Yamaha XT250H
1981 KZ440 LTD project bike
1981 GPz550
2013 Yamaha FZ6R

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  • SWest
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20 Sep 2024 07:37 #904487 by SWest
Replied by SWest on topic 7th Gear Designs
That could be a lean condition or an exhaust leak.

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22 Sep 2024 05:25 #904522 by Feanor_twh
Replied by Feanor_twh on topic 7th Gear Designs

You can check the ignition advance with an "adjustable" timing light. Set the engine speed at the required revs then dial in the timing light until the TDC mark is aligned. You can then read the advance data from the display on the timing light
PS: have you grounded the brown and blue wires as per the fitting instructions ?

This ignition has a triple spark system which according to the seller is not compatible with the timing light, As explained here:  7thgeardesigns.com/FAQ_Downloads.html

Have you successfully used an ignition light? I have one, but it is not adjustable

(1976) Kawasaki KZ400-D3. All original, but: electronic reg/rec (Oregon Motorcycle Parts), new handlebar controls (w/ PASS/HORN/lights switch, LED dash lights (superbrightleds.com), Dynatek coil (3ohm), MAC mufflers, HEL brake hoses, rubber fork boots, 4.00 rear tyre (Dunlop K70), chromed chainguard

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22 Sep 2024 05:26 #904523 by Feanor_twh
Replied by Feanor_twh on topic 7th Gear Designs

Detonation on deceleration?  Are you sure?  I've never heard of such a thing.

 

I believe Feanor is from Spain and not a native speaker of English. I think he meant that there is backfiring on deceleration, which would be an easy mistake to make.
Thanks, that's what I meant. But apparently it's been fixed now.

(1976) Kawasaki KZ400-D3. All original, but: electronic reg/rec (Oregon Motorcycle Parts), new handlebar controls (w/ PASS/HORN/lights switch, LED dash lights (superbrightleds.com), Dynatek coil (3ohm), MAC mufflers, HEL brake hoses, rubber fork boots, 4.00 rear tyre (Dunlop K70), chromed chainguard

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22 Sep 2024 09:48 - 22 Sep 2024 10:07 #904525 by Wookie58
Replied by Wookie58 on topic 7th Gear Designs

You can check the ignition advance with an "adjustable" timing light. Set the engine speed at the required revs then dial in the timing light until the TDC mark is aligned. You can then read the advance data from the display on the timing light
PS: have you grounded the brown and blue wires as per the fitting instructions ?

This ignition has a triple spark system which according to the seller is not compatible with the timing light, As explained here:  7thgeardesigns.com/FAQ_Downloads.html

Have you successfully used an ignition light? I have one, but it is not adjustable
You didn't mention the brown and blue wires - from what I read not grounding these will give you the symptoms you described (not revving past 5500) looking at the link you posted a timing light isn't going to work correctly with this set-up so you can only assume the advance is correct !!
Last edit: 22 Sep 2024 10:07 by Wookie58.

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24 Sep 2024 18:22 - 24 Sep 2024 18:29 #904581 by Feanor_twh
Replied by Feanor_twh on topic 7th Gear Designs

You can check the ignition advance with an "adjustable" timing light. Set the engine speed at the required revs then dial in the timing light until the TDC mark is aligned. You can then read the advance data from the display on the timing light
PS: have you grounded the brown and blue wires as per the fitting instructions ?

This ignition has a triple spark system which according to the seller is not compatible with the timing light, As explained here:  7thgeardesigns.com/FAQ_Downloads.html

Have you successfully used an ignition light? I have one, but it is not adjustable
You didn't mention the brown and blue wires - from what I read not grounding these will give you the symptoms you described (not revving past 5500) looking at the link you posted a timing light isn't going to work correctly with this set-up so you can only assume the advance is correct !!
Yes, brown and blue wires grounded.

As someone already suggested, it could be that the TDC mark on the crankcase does not match the real TDC, I didn't check this. However, with the points there was no ignition problem, which makes me assume that it is fine.
It seems that the ignition map is incorrect. I can't think of anything else. I'm waiting for a response from 7thgeardesigns (he probably won't answer) and I also wrote to Power Arc. I'll post about what I find out.

(1976) Kawasaki KZ400-D3. All original, but: electronic reg/rec (Oregon Motorcycle Parts), new handlebar controls (w/ PASS/HORN/lights switch, LED dash lights (superbrightleds.com), Dynatek coil (3ohm), MAC mufflers, HEL brake hoses, rubber fork boots, 4.00 rear tyre (Dunlop K70), chromed chainguard
Last edit: 24 Sep 2024 18:29 by Feanor_twh.

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25 Sep 2024 00:20 #904589 by Wookie58
Replied by Wookie58 on topic 7th Gear Designs
The factory TDC mark my well be "a few degree's off" (manufacturing tolerances) but it wouldn't be enough to give you this problem, certainly sounds like a mapping issue (unfortunately due to the nature of the system you have no way that I am aware of to actually check the advance)

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25 Sep 2024 14:22 #904609 by DoctoRot
Replied by DoctoRot on topic 7th Gear Designs
It is possible that the incorrect timing curve is loaded on your ignition. Total advance should be happening at 3000RPM. Here is the ignition curve that Powerarc created for the KZ twins, taken from their software. You can connect the ignition to a windows based computer to access the timing maps and use the Powerarc software. Its also possible to connect the extra wire to trigger a second map.

what spark plugs are you running? Power arc requires the use of resistor spark plugs. Could be a fuel mixture issue as demonstrated by increased popping on decel.

 
The following user(s) said Thank You: Wookie58

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25 Sep 2024 15:38 #904615 by Wookie58
Replied by Wookie58 on topic 7th Gear Designs
Are you sure you have a "good" ground on the brown and blue - you can check his with a voltmeter with the engine running (meter on DCV black meter lead to battery negative terminal - red meter lead to your ground connection, any more than 0.3v signifies a bad ground which triggers a softer advance map)

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26 Sep 2024 00:50 #904618 by Wookie58
Replied by Wookie58 on topic 7th Gear Designs
I would suggest that you go back through the install and check all grounds and power supply's with a voltmeter, as Doc says ensure you are using "resistor" plugs.
You might want to try installing "exactly" as per the instructions without your mod to include the original baseplate - hopefully the unit isn't faulty as reading the "warranty terms" you have no warranty due to your modification of the base plate (cutting a hole in it) !!!!!      

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06 Oct 2024 08:48 #904896 by Feanor_twh
Replied by Feanor_twh on topic 7th Gear Designs

It is possible that the incorrect timing curve is loaded on your ignition. Total advance should be happening at 3000RPM. Here is the ignition curve that Powerarc created for the KZ twins, taken from their software. You can connect the ignition to a windows based computer to access the timing maps and use the Powerarc software. Its also possible to connect the extra wire to trigger a second map.

what spark plugs are you running? Power arc requires the use of resistor spark plugs. Could be a fuel mixture issue as demonstrated by increased popping on decel.

 
I did tests with the ignition gun, which although not suitable for this type of ignition, gave conclusive results:

The ignition advances progressively from the F mark to the two-line mark of the total advance through the first 3,000 rpm.
After that, it remains steady until about 5,700 rpm, when it begins to oscillate between the two lines and the F mark.
Finally (6,000 rpm onwards) the ignition moves back to a point between the F and T marks (closer to T) and continues in that position for the rest of the rpm range.

All tests gave the same results. I deduce from this that the device is not broken, it sounds more like an incorrect ignition mapping.

What do you think?
 

(1976) Kawasaki KZ400-D3. All original, but: electronic reg/rec (Oregon Motorcycle Parts), new handlebar controls (w/ PASS/HORN/lights switch, LED dash lights (superbrightleds.com), Dynatek coil (3ohm), MAC mufflers, HEL brake hoses, rubber fork boots, 4.00 rear tyre (Dunlop K70), chromed chainguard

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