Points, Yes or No?

Talking to a mechanic about my 78 kz650sr, it was recommended that I change out my Points for an electrical ignition conversion. Just wondering if this is a good idea, and what products (if any) I should consider buying.

Points are perfectly fine, some say better. I have a Dyna S but carry my points plate and cam just in case. People say a lot of things when it's not their money on the line. :whistle:
Steve

My '77 KZ650 has points. There are pros and cons to each system, but I have no plans to ever switch to electronic ignition. I'm not anti-electronic ignition. None of my 3 cars or my truck use points. Many folks have made the switch on their KZ's and are happy with it; some made the switch and had difficulties with the charging system or failures in the electronic components.

I've put 59,000+ miles on my bike, and I replace the points and condenser about every 8 - 10,000 miles or so. The set in the bike now have been there for more than 9,000 miles and work perfectly fine. It takes me about 1/2 hour to replace them; that includes getting my tools out, cleaning up, and drinking a beer when done. Doing that once every 3 years or so doesn't present a hardship for me. If you have never replaced points yourself I can post instructions that will get you started. It isn't particularly difficult to do.

Electronic ignition doesn't require routine maintenance, but when electronic ignition fails, it fails hard and leaves you walking. Points gradually wear and periodically require replacing, but they don't fail hard. I like that fact when I'm on the bike 100 miles from home.

Some electronic ignition systems put more demand on the charging system than others, and I believe most if not all require more current than points, so the selection of an electronic system should be done carefully. If you switch, be sure you first understand what the load is going to be on your charging system and whether or not your bike's system can handle it. Unlike the 1977 KZ650 excited filed 3-phase system or the 1981 and later KZ650 permanent magnet 3-phase systems, the 1978 KZ650 charging system is a single phase system. That system is arguably the weakest of the lot. Given that, putting an electronic ignition system on that bike may cause problems depending on the power demands of the system you select. There has been much written about the excessive load the Dyna-S system puts on the single phase charging systems and the resulting problems.

One other factor is the expense. If you install electronic ignition be sure to factor in the cost of the coils that you most likely will need to buy to match the ignition system requirements. When you add up the cost of all the components you need you can compare that to the cost of the points and condensers you will need while you own the bike plus the cost of a timing light and dwell meter which you should use to very accurately adjust the points. These tools are not particularly expensive, and it helps to have them when replacing points.
Ed

My old Dyna S died because of a broken battery ground. I limped home on two cylinders. I never forgot that. Most of my trips are 100 miles or more so I carry the few tools needed to make repairs short of a overhaul. The closest store is five miles, still a long way to walk.
Steve

There is no con to electronic ignition. Points are the most obsolete system of ignition ever. I bought my 78 KZ650 new and rode 10,000 miles, and in that time would estimate I had to adjust/otherwise fool with points 15 times. Every 600 miles frick with these useless things? Not for me. I went Dyna and never looked back, clear back in 1979. I would wager to guess most these old Kawasakis that got junked and sat out in the yard had something to do with points ignition system and the fact it has no reliability.

With the 78 KZ650, if you go to the Dyna S, there is a chance the charge system will be maxed out. Don't get new coils until you test the Dyna S with the old 4 ohm coils. If the charging system seems to have more than enough capacity, then get new 3 ohm coils. If not, then you may want to get new non-Dyna 4 ohm coils or Dyna 5 ohm coils.

Let the bike warm up and read the battery voltage with the Dyna S installed with the old coils and bike running at about 1500~1700 RPM. If the battery is over 14v and holding steady, then it's probably ok.

When I restored my 1980 650 I put a dyna S ignition and s set of green 3 ohm coils. The ignition worked great but I did develop a issue with my charging system as Lou warned about.

Here is a discussion of my problem, and on the second page shows how I upgraded my charging system.
www.kzrider.com/forum/4-electrical/59409...-stator?limitstart=0

The dual points system in the 650 works just fine, the dyna pickups and coils do make a hotter spark, but you can also find a later type factory electronic ignition and use the pickups and igniter without running into a possible issue with your charging system. The 81 to 83 650's and all the 750's used an electrIc ignition.

RonKZ650 wrote: There is no con to electronic ignition. .

Except when they fail. IMHO, points/coil are more rugged against over voltage failures and even when coils go bad they usually run rough and give some signs. Electronic boxes typically fail instantly with no warning and leave you stranded.

I fitted a hybrid ignition to my Z650B1, no problems. It keeps the points, but adds an additional transistor unit, that reduces wear on the points and acts as a 'points amplifier'.

sohc4shop.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=32

The following is from the site:

'The primary advantages of this system:

1. The original dwell is preserved (no other electronic replacement system provides this feature).

2. The power consumption is only 0.1 amp more than stock, max. In comparison: the typical Dyna S uses a little over 1 amp extra current, as do other similar "electronic trigger" systems.

3. Points and condensors stay in place: this provides 100% backup if the electronics should ever fail. You can unplug the 4 wires to the points and coils, plug the points back into the coils, and hit the road again in (literally) about 2 minutes, even on a hot bike.

4. This unit has a 5-year, 100% warranty: if it fails, I'll fix it for return postage only.'

Yes, if you understand the ignition system and recommended service maintenance. If you rather not bother with points, and that's perfectly fine, grab the right Dyna S and make sure the rest of the ignition system is capable.

The idea here is to enjoy riding!

like Ed I have been running points on my (K)Z650 since I bought it new in 77. Do they require more maintenance than an elec systems ... yes ...... and they may be more durable, not sure that is true,. But I find something cathartic in placing my hands on the machine, it requires my attention, which I find to be a good thing.

The real advantage to electronic ignitions is no maintenance. I installed a Dyna S on my KZ650 when they first came out and have not touched it once. Every couple of years I check the timing just to be sure and it's been spot on since I installed it. A truly install and forget upgrade. I have over 100,000 miles on the Dyna S without ever doing anything to it. With points you are constantly fiddling with them.