Charging issue/question

Nessism wrote: Before you spend money on an R/R try this experiment: probe into your + terminal at the R/R, and then put the other probe on the + battery post and rev the engine. If you get more than .2 volts that means you still have wiring losses. Next, do the same thing on the - output at the R/R and the - battery post.

BTW, 13.9 volts isn't the best but the bike will be rideable.

I remember now why I worry. That 13.9 is more like 13.5 to 13.9. It would jump a little bit over a 5 minute period. At idle it has been a steady 12.7.

missionkz wrote: Used to be 13.8vdc to 14.2v was a good 12v system.
What has changed, other then over charging the battery at 14.5vdc-15vdc and eventually boiling out the water?

A relative read...
www.yahoo.com/autos/question-of-the-day-...ep-128113860587.html

While I have not had the opportunity to check the regulator to see if I'm having any voltage loss, I can tell you this. I went for a pretty long ride and during the ride I would check the voltage sporadically. When I would decelerate, the charge would shoot way over past 15 and immediately drop back to around 14. Overcharging or the dash just being inaccurate?

Upon arriving home, the bike started fine ( other than the starter clutch being a bastard) so I decided to check the voltage with my voltmeter. The battery was giving me a solid 12.6/7 with nothing on. At idle, the same. At 4k, I was getting 13.8-14.0. This was with 2 different voltmeters. My Labor Day promise is to check the connections where the fuses have been replaced to see if the crimps were done correctly. I've a feeling they have not.

Your 13.8-14.0V at 4000rpm sounds fine - in fact, that sounds perfect to me. Some people think you need more, but too much and it will wear your battery faster.

The idle voltage being the same as the 'bike off' voltage is what worries me. This means that sitting at idle is discharging your battery - if you have your headlight on and in heavy traffic, you could drain the battery.

As for your voltage spikes, most electronic components can cause spikes, but you battery should act as a large capacitor - it will resist a sudden change in voltage. None of your electrical components should spike enough to make that much difference - unless the battery has a loose connection. A loose connection on the battery can cause these spikes by itself, so double check that - it could be your connections moving when you decelerate. Also make sure that your battery is connected to a proper ground - when I got my bike I had some starter and charging issues, turned out to be the battery was grounded to the battery box, which is electronically isulated from the rest of the frame!

Just to be sure though - check your voltage at 4000rpm, then check at idle. I'm not sure if these alternators need it, but some alternators do need an initial excitation current - some alternators will not start charging until they have hit a higher rev range, when they kick in, and then the rpm can drop again and they will charge normally. Unlikely, but do check - I know my car does this.

Irish Yobbo wrote: Your 13.8-14.0V at 4000rpm sounds fine - in fact, that sounds perfect to me. Some people think you need more, but too much and it will wear your battery faster.

The idle voltage being the same as the 'bike off' voltage is what worries me. This means that sitting at idle is discharging your battery - if you have your headlight on and in heavy traffic, you could drain the battery.

As for your voltage spikes, most electronic components can cause spikes, but you battery should act as a large capacitor - it will resist a sudden change in voltage. None of your electrical components should spike enough to make that much difference - unless the battery has a loose connection. A loose connection on the battery can cause these spikes by itself, so double check that - it could be your connections moving when you decelerate. Also make sure that your battery is connected to a proper ground - when I got my bike I had some starter and charging issues, turned out to be the battery was grounded to the battery box, which is electronically insulated from the rest of the frame!

Just to be sure though - check your voltage at 4000rpm, then check at idle. I'm not sure if these alternators need it, but some alternators do need an initial excitation current - some alternators will not start charging until they have hit a higher rev range, when they kick in, and then the rpm can drop again and they will charge normally. Unlikely, but do check - I know my car does this.

I addressed many of these things in prior posts, but I'll be checking the crimps for the updated fuses later today to make sure there is no loss and doing what Nessism suggested by checking the voltage drop at the R/R.

What do I do about the connector for the R/R. It seems to be different than any of them I have looked at. Is that normal?

If it has the larger blade type connectors, that's a good thing. Mine use to have the small prong type that got hot and burned. When I went to the modern R/R I changed to the blade connectors. You can still feel them getting hot but not to the point of burning.
Steve

So again, probe the + and - terminals at the R/R and their corresponding battery post. You want to make sure there is no voltage loss from the R/R on the way back to the battery. It's quite common for there to be some losses through the fuse box and/or the ground path.

You also need to make sure you have low resistance connections between the stator wires and the R/R. Bypass the factory harness even if you are not sure. Some people solder the wires between the stator and R/R to assure low resistance. It's extremely common for there to be burned connectors in that path.

Nessism wrote: So again, probe the + and - terminals at the R/R and their corresponding battery post. You want to make sure there is no voltage loss from the R/R on the way back to the battery. It's quite common for there to be some losses through the fuse box and/or the ground path.

You also need to make sure you have low resistance connections between the stator wires and the R/R. Bypass the factory harness even if you are not sure. Some people solder the wires between the stator and R/R to assure low resistance. It's extremely common for there to be burned connectors in that path.

So I tested for dropped volts as you laid out and I got .01 and .02 on different voltmeters. Within spec it seems. Again I tested the battery at rest, 12.6, and at 4k, I was getting 13.8. I took the bike for a long ride, got home, let it cool off and the battery at rest was still 12.6. I took a look at the newly crimped blade fuses that replaced the glass fuses and replaced a couple of them that seemed to be sketchy. At idle, the charging jumped to 12.8-13.0, higher than it has been thus far. I'll be riding to work tomorrow so I'll get a good test.

It seems I will be replacing the r/r.

Well, idle is back to charging at 12.5 and 4k rpm is about 13.6-13.8. I've ordered a new r/r so I hope this will solve the issue. If so, I'll invest in the expensive one suggested and keep this cheap one as a back up. While flipping through the manual last night, I found an old receipt for a r/r from Kawasaki in 1994. So the one in the bike is, at the oldest, 21 years old. It's done it's time I would say.

13.8 is not bad with the headlight on. Running lights too? I went to LED's because all my lights were taking all the system could give.
Steve

swest wrote: 13.8 is not bad with the headlight on. Running lights too? I went to LED's because all my lights were taking all the system could give.
Steve

I'm giving thought to the LED's. I need more research but it seems like a viable option for my bike provided I don't have to do much in the way of permanent mods affecting the originality of my bike.

No, plug and play.
Steve