Headlight causing electrical problems?

IMHO, Dyna is using this 1 1/4 Ohm resistor as a current limiting resistor... that's fine. It should do two things:

1) Reduce the Current going into the Low Voltage input to the Coils.

2) Reduce the High Voltage output from the Coils.

BTW, at a nominal 12 Vdc you are dropping about 3.5 Volts just across the current limiting resistor leaving 8.5 Volts across the Coil input... and the input Coil current input drops from about 4 Amp to about 2.4 Amp (the math is always correct but the acutal Voltage, Resistance and Current readings are always approximate, also is his 1.5 amps Peak or Average? These fuses blow on Peak):

(Resistor /(Resistor + Coil)) x (1.25/(1.26+3)) x 12 V = 3.5 Volts

12 V - 3.5 V = 8.5 Vdc

Current = Voltage / Resistance = 12 / 3 = 4.0 Amps

Current = Voltage / Resistance = 12 / 5 = 2.4 Amps

Nothing for free right... change the input and you change the output. You can accomplish much the same by simply using the Black 5 Ohm Coils to start with.

---

The above is all a Red Herring anyways because the KZ650s' Charging System has the capacity.

Back to basics. I would suggest you re-focus on the changing system... you should have enough information to move forward in that direction.

Best of success,
Bill

Bill, a couple of things.

First, if 5 ohm coils are better for this application, I wonder why z1enterprises only sells the 3 ohm coils, and why everyone I can find who runs the Dyna-S ignition is also running the 3 ohm coils.

And I have not focused strictly on the coils. There is still the dim headlight and the voltage drop from 12v out of the fuseblock to 8v at the headlight, and the charging output, too.

I think I have at least three separate issues, and I'm thinking I need to focus on one, resolve it, then move on to the next, resolve it, then move onto the next.

Tim and I have parted ways, so I'm in the process of looking for an expert to help on this.

Also, what did you think of Raymond's idea of going to the ZX600 regulator/rectifier? I've searced it, but could find no instance of anyone on here or on KZ650.info doing it.

IMHO, Green 3 Ohm Coils are what you need. I was simply explaining why I did NOT think the Current Limiting Resistor was necessary. Stick with 3 Ohms, that's what I did and it has worked incredibly well.

The original charging system is satisfactory. I have never worked a "ZX600 regulator/rectifier" so I have no opinion on that matter. I prefer not to comment on things I have not done or on bikes I have not worked on.

Best of success,
Bill

OK, so the other night I decided to take the bike out for a ride. It had been on the battery Tender Jr. for several days, and the light was green, so it had a full charge.

I rode the bike for about 40 miles, and it was a pleasure. The carbs are perfect (at least for normal riding), so it started right up, no bogging or stumbles, just a great, smooth running bike.

I made several stops along the way, Each time, the bike started immediately, with just a slight spin of the starter. When I got home, I shut the bike off. Wanting to gauge how well the starter still spun (and therefore how much juice the battery had lost), I tried to start it up. No good.

The starter spun fine, but the bike wouldn't fire. tried no gas, giving it a little gas, WOT, a little choke, full choke, and every combination of the above, and it never even came close to starting.

I tried the kickstarter .... instant, immediate, perfect start with no choke, no throttle. Shut it off and tried the electric start again .... no good. Kickstart, immediate.

I took it for another ride a couple of hours later. It started perfectly on the elctric starter, and ran great for 25 mles, or so, starting right up after each of the stops I made. After I got it home, though, I shut it off and tried to restart it. Same as before. Electric start ... no. Kickstart, yes.

I was thnking a kickstart would probably rotate the engine faster than the electric starter. That would be the only difference between the electric start and the kickstart that I could think of.

Someone else suggested the coils may be putting out less when they heat up; hence the hard-starting. Does that happen with coils? Once the bike starts, it runs perfectly. My experience with coils in cars is they either work, or they don't. Can coils partially fail?

I'm also wondering if this is connected with the electrical problems I'm having. If something is happening with the coils when they're hot that makes the bike harder to start, could that also affect the amount of power they draw?

Could I have the coils or the WG mod wired wrong and still have the bike run perfectly, except for when it gets hot?

Also, I need to get an inexpensive multimeter to start looking for this myself. Money is really tight right now, so I need to get what I need for as little as possible. I saw these at Harbor Freight. If any, which would be what I need? Also, what a bout a circuit testing light?

www.harborfreight.com/3-1-2-half-inch-lc...meter-kit-95670.html

IMHO, this does not sound like a coil issue.

If the WG Coil Re-powering mod or the coils were wired wrong I would expect that the bike would not start, period.

Sounds as if your Battery Tender Jr. battery charger is doing a great job and it even sounds as if your battery is in pretty good shape if it can build back up its charge overnight. Wire in the BTJr. charger connector permanently and leave it on charge whenever you are not using your bike... you will be surprised at how this will extend the like of you battery. The quick-connect connector for the BTJr. charger comes with the kit... just wire it directly across the battery and hide the charging connector under one of the side covers where you can reach it easily.

The symptoms still suggest a battery charging issue or as a long shot, a ground return issue. The Carbs and the Ignition system sound great.

(PS, with the KZ650 the Throttle must remain closed while starting the bike, kick or electric. Choke position will depend on engine and ambient air temperature.)

Yes, you are in deep, deep need of a meter like this. However, I'm not sure how accurate it will be on the 200 Ohm scale trying to read the difference between 3 Ohms and 5 Ohms for Coils, but then most meters have precision issues at the extreme ends of each scale... and the price won't hurt too much.

When you have a Test Light you usually end up needing a Meter. But when you have a Meter you seldom need a Test Light. So I for one, would skip the Test Light altogether.

BTW, I've lost track here... do you have a Manual, yes or no? I yes which one, if no... you need one big time.

Best of success,
Bill

bill_wilcox100 wrote:

IMHO, this does not sound like a coil issue.

Bill, thanks for answering. What do you think it could be, then? To my admittedly untrained eyes, it doesn't seem to be a fueling issue. On the electric starter, it doesn't appear to be firing at all; it just spins and spins. On the kickstarter, it starts immediately, perfectly, on the first kick.

bill_wilcox100 wrote:

If the WG Coil Re-powering mod or the coils were wired wrong I would expect that the bike would not start, period.

That makes sense to me. What about the coils themselves. Could they "partially" fail? Could they have a problem when they get hot that they don't have when they're cool? With cars, it's always been my experience that coils either work, or they don't, but "my experience" don't mean that much.

bill_wilcox100 wrote:

Sounds as if your Battery Tender Jr. battery charger is doing a great job and it even sounds as if your battery is in pretty good shape if it can build back up its charge overnight. Wire in the BTJr. charger connector permanently and leave it on charge whenever you are not using your bike... you will be surprised at how this will extend the like of you battery. The quick-connect connector for the BTJr. charger comes with the kit... just wire it directly across the battery and hide the charging connector under one of the side covers where you can reach it easily.

Yeah, I have it installed.

bill_wilcox100 wrote:

The symptoms still suggest a battery charging issue or as a long shot, a ground return issue. The Carbs and the Ignition system sound great.

sigh ...........

bill_wilcox100 wrote:

Yes, you are in deep, deep need of a meter like this. However, I'm not sure how accurate it will be on the 200 Ohm scale trying to read the difference between 3 Ohms and 5 Ohms for Coils, but then most meters have precision issues at the extreme ends of each scale... and the price won't hurt too much.

When you have a Test Light you usually end up needing a Meter. But when you have a Meter you seldom need a Test Light. So I for one, would skip the Test Light altogether.

Well, I need advice on what meter to get then. Clymer says to test the stator, which is good at 3 ohms resistance, or less, and bad at anything higher, you set the scale on R x 1. Isn't that the 100 ohm scale? Sorry if that's a stupid question, but I think we've established by now that I know nothing about electrical systems.

I stopped and looked at Wal Mart last night, they have two; One for 17.99, and another for 25.99. The thing is, I don't know how to tell which would be better for me, or wht the difference is between them and the 3.99 one at Harbor freight. Sears has a pretty broad selection, too, but again, i don't know what to buy.

www.sears.com/shc/s/search_10153_12605?v...on=UNITS_HIGH_TO_LOW

Here's what K-Mart has;

www.kmart.com/shc/s/search_10151_10104?k...rd=multimeter&vName=

And again, harbor Freight

www.harborfreight.com/3-1-2-half-inch-lc...meter-kit-95670.html

Can someone help with a recommendation, or two?

bill_wilcox100 wrote:

BTW, I've lost track here... do you have a Manual, yes or no? I yes which one, if no... you need one big time.

Best of success,
Bill

I've gotten a Clymer manual, a factory service manual, and I got a wiring diagram and blew it up to 11 x 17 so you can actually read it.

seanof30306 wrote:

...On the electric starter, it doesn't appear to be firing at all; it just spins and spins. On the kickstarter, it starts immediately, perfectly, on the first kick....

To help diagnosis, would jump bike battery to known good car battery (car engine NOT running) and repeat effort to crank using starter.

If bike engine cranks with the jump, the bike battery is deficient for whatever reason.

Also assure integrity of ground where negative battery cable attaches to rear of engine.

Good Fortune!

Do what Patton suggests.

If the bike starts with Electric starter on the car battery, then the bike battery is still a problem replace and charge.. or the big Red positive and Black negative from the battery have dirty/poor connections and or the wires themselves are bad.

If the bike still does not start with the Electric start on the car battery, then pushing the Start Button is doing something to the voltage trying to reach the coils... jumper the battery positive directly (through an inline fuse) to one of the Coil inputs (I'm thinking bad fuse contact on one or more fuse clip in the OEM fuse box... I had that on mine). Caution: don't leave the battery jumper on the coil when then the bike is not running!

Best of success,
Bill

Have you tried to use the starter with the lights off. My 650 would start first time on the kicker but not the starter unless I turned off the light. Gives the starter a little more juice at startup. Mine turned out to be a jetting and ignition problem. New Dyna coils and Dyna S with a jetting change and all is good

OK, before anything else, can someone please help me with the choice on the multimeter?

Regarding the voltage drop at headlight connector.

Does this bike have a rider operated on-off switch for the headlight (as shown in the wiring diagram)?

If not already checked, am wondering if the headlight switch might be corroded inside and causing the drop-down in voltage to the headlight. Just guessing. Same thing for the ignition switch.

As to multi-meter, I prefer the swinging needle style as opposed to digital.

Good Fortune!

No, it's a '79 model. It has no headlight switch.