KZ1000 bunch of teardown questions
- KZmarcel
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21 Feb 2022 19:05 - 21 Feb 2022 19:09 #862709
by KZmarcel
WA state, USA
1981 KZ1000 Ltd project for me
kzrider.com/forum/11-projects/617085-kz1000-full-spa#861637
1982 KZ440 Ltd project for my wife
1991 Yamaha 1200 VMax
2005 Kawasaki Vulcan 2000
1971 Buick Riviera boat-tail
2004 Jaguar XJR
1999 Dodge Ram 5.7L Magnum
1977 John Deere 400
KZ1000 bunch of teardown questions was created by KZmarcel
Hi folks,
bunch of questions as I remove the engine covers for polishing:
To do so, I had to drain the oil, which somehow I did not do right upon bringing the bike home (it was so crusty I dove right into cleaning and stripping stuff off).
Question A: the oil looked dark brown more than black and smells lightly of fuel. How concerned should I be ?
Question B: there was nasty sludge at the bottom of the clutch. See photo below. How concerned should I be ?
Question C: the alternator stator has black-ish stuff on most but not all of the windings. See photo below. How concerned should I be ?
Question the ignition stuff behind the first cover looked new. But behind it, there are traces of reddish powder, redder than rust. See photo below. How concerned should I be ?
I don't know much about the entrails of such an engine, and this whole process is also intended as a pretext for hands-on learning about mechanics and electrics.
But it's late and I don't want to read the whole workshop manual now, so I thought I'd just throw these questions in case folks need a reason to chime in with pithy comments.
Looking forward !
bunch of questions as I remove the engine covers for polishing:
To do so, I had to drain the oil, which somehow I did not do right upon bringing the bike home (it was so crusty I dove right into cleaning and stripping stuff off).
Question A: the oil looked dark brown more than black and smells lightly of fuel. How concerned should I be ?
Question B: there was nasty sludge at the bottom of the clutch. See photo below. How concerned should I be ?
Question C: the alternator stator has black-ish stuff on most but not all of the windings. See photo below. How concerned should I be ?
Question the ignition stuff behind the first cover looked new. But behind it, there are traces of reddish powder, redder than rust. See photo below. How concerned should I be ?
I don't know much about the entrails of such an engine, and this whole process is also intended as a pretext for hands-on learning about mechanics and electrics.
But it's late and I don't want to read the whole workshop manual now, so I thought I'd just throw these questions in case folks need a reason to chime in with pithy comments.
Looking forward !
WA state, USA
1981 KZ1000 Ltd project for me
kzrider.com/forum/11-projects/617085-kz1000-full-spa#861637
1982 KZ440 Ltd project for my wife
1991 Yamaha 1200 VMax
2005 Kawasaki Vulcan 2000
1971 Buick Riviera boat-tail
2004 Jaguar XJR
1999 Dodge Ram 5.7L Magnum
1977 John Deere 400
Last edit: 21 Feb 2022 19:09 by KZmarcel. Reason: typos
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- TexasKZ
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21 Feb 2022 20:08 #862713
by TexasKZ
1982 KZ1000 LTD parts donor
1981 KZ1000 LTD awaiting resurrection
2000 ZRX1100 not ridden enough
Replied by TexasKZ on topic KZ1000 bunch of teardown questions
A: Fuel smell is a sign that the petcock and at least one carb’s float valve have failed. Common problem. Not a big deal.
B: That color sludge suggests water in the oil. Much more worrisome than fuel. Look closely at bearings and transmission parts for rust.
C: Looks like dried oil sludge. A few miles with fresh oil may reduce that a bit. I would put that low on the worry list.
Interesting. Have no idea.
B: That color sludge suggests water in the oil. Much more worrisome than fuel. Look closely at bearings and transmission parts for rust.
C: Looks like dried oil sludge. A few miles with fresh oil may reduce that a bit. I would put that low on the worry list.
Interesting. Have no idea.
1982 KZ1000 LTD parts donor
1981 KZ1000 LTD awaiting resurrection
2000 ZRX1100 not ridden enough
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- u.k. Dave
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22 Feb 2022 13:04 #862764
by u.k. Dave
Replied by u.k. Dave on topic KZ1000 bunch of teardown questions
Looks like emulsified oil in there due to condensation or water ingress, can also be caused by repeated start ups for short periods and not getting the engine warm enough to vaporise the condensation. Likewise fuel vapours will bypass rings and contaminate oil as a matter of course which is driven out once the engine gets hot. Although I would agree with the previous poster, fuel ingress from fuel bypassing the petcock even if off is a known issue compounded by the bike being parked for long period on its side stand and weeping float needle valves. Sludge under clutch basket is common on machines not used much / abused / infrequent oil changes etc. If it were me I would certainly pull the sump pan and clean it all out, you may be shocked at the amount of sludge you will find, it will also give you a good opportunity to have a good look round inside. You will no doubt see quite a bit of flash or surface rusting on the gear clusters and crank webs, this is not a concern, get it as clean as you can, run fresh oil and filter, change oil after 400 hundred miles and refill with fresh, leave filter in till next change at a thousand miles and it should stay way cleaner. If the bike has been laid up for a while there will be a number of other things to check and service to make it dafe and reliable!
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- KZmarcel
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23 Feb 2022 01:48 #862798
by KZmarcel
I will remove the pan and have a look-see and do as you suggest, makes sense.
More soon !
WA state, USA
1981 KZ1000 Ltd project for me
kzrider.com/forum/11-projects/617085-kz1000-full-spa#861637
1982 KZ440 Ltd project for my wife
1991 Yamaha 1200 VMax
2005 Kawasaki Vulcan 2000
1971 Buick Riviera boat-tail
2004 Jaguar XJR
1999 Dodge Ram 5.7L Magnum
1977 John Deere 400
Replied by KZmarcel on topic KZ1000 bunch of teardown questions
Thanks ! all good advice.Looks like emulsified oil in there due to condensation or water ingress, can also be caused by repeated start ups for short periods and not getting the engine warm enough to vaporise the condensation. Likewise fuel vapours will bypass rings and contaminate oil as a matter of course which is driven out once the engine gets hot. Although I would agree with the previous poster, fuel ingress from fuel bypassing the petcock even if off is a known issue compounded by the bike being parked for long period on its side stand and weeping float needle valves. Sludge under clutch basket is common on machines not used much / abused / infrequent oil changes etc. If it were me I would certainly pull the sump pan and clean it all out, you may be shocked at the amount of sludge you will find, it will also give you a good opportunity to have a good look round inside. You will no doubt see quite a bit of flash or surface rusting on the gear clusters and crank webs, this is not a concern, get it as clean as you can, run fresh oil and filter, change oil after 400 hundred miles and refill with fresh, leave filter in till next change at a thousand miles and it should stay way cleaner. If the bike has been laid up for a while there will be a number of other things to check and service to make it dafe and reliable!
I will remove the pan and have a look-see and do as you suggest, makes sense.
More soon !
WA state, USA
1981 KZ1000 Ltd project for me
kzrider.com/forum/11-projects/617085-kz1000-full-spa#861637
1982 KZ440 Ltd project for my wife
1991 Yamaha 1200 VMax
2005 Kawasaki Vulcan 2000
1971 Buick Riviera boat-tail
2004 Jaguar XJR
1999 Dodge Ram 5.7L Magnum
1977 John Deere 400
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- slmjim+Z1BEBE
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23 Feb 2022 07:31 #862812
by slmjim+Z1BEBE
A biker looks at your engine and chrome.
A Rider looks at your odometer and tags.
1973 ('72 builds) Z1 x2
1974 Z1-A x2
1975 Z1-B x2
1993 CB 750 Nighthawk x2
2009 ST1300A
www.kawasaki-z-classik.com
An enthusiast's forum focused exclusively
on all things Z1, Z2 and KZ900.
Replied by slmjim+Z1BEBE on topic KZ1000 bunch of teardown questions
The red dust in the R.H engine cover is very likely fine rust particles thrown out from within the advancer mechanism by centrifugal force. It may never have been serviced.
The advancer lives on the end of the crankshaft, indexed by a small pin pressed into the end of the crank re: TDC of cyls. 1-4 and 2-3.. A small amount of grease was applied at the factory to the inside of the rotating sleeve of the advancer, along with the advancer shaft around which the sleeve rotates. The advancer sleeve rotates around the advancer shaft when the counterweights (the small arms held in place by springs) are forced outward by centrifugal force to advance spark timing as engine RPM rises from idle. The factory grease deteriorates with heat & age, leading to sluggish advancer operation or, sometimes, seizing completely.
We'd suggest disassembling, cleaning & re-lubing the advancer mechanism. Work on a comfortable, flat surface, in good light. A towel works well for us, as it will keep the tiny C-clips from escaping easily; be careful removing them, as they like to fly away & are difficult to find. Be very gentle with the springs, taking great care not to overstretch them during disassembly; they're calibrated for tension. Note the positions of the tiny washers on the counterweight pins. Before disassembly, mark the end of rotating sleeve and the shaft around which it rotates wioth a scribe so you don't reassemble it 180° out of sync. Use only enough high-temperature grease to coat the inside of the rotating sleeve, and mostly fill the groove on the advancer shaft.. There should be instructions in the KZ1000 manual for dis/re-assembly of the advancer mechanism.
Good Ridin';
slmjim & Z1BEBE
The advancer lives on the end of the crankshaft, indexed by a small pin pressed into the end of the crank re: TDC of cyls. 1-4 and 2-3.. A small amount of grease was applied at the factory to the inside of the rotating sleeve of the advancer, along with the advancer shaft around which the sleeve rotates. The advancer sleeve rotates around the advancer shaft when the counterweights (the small arms held in place by springs) are forced outward by centrifugal force to advance spark timing as engine RPM rises from idle. The factory grease deteriorates with heat & age, leading to sluggish advancer operation or, sometimes, seizing completely.
We'd suggest disassembling, cleaning & re-lubing the advancer mechanism. Work on a comfortable, flat surface, in good light. A towel works well for us, as it will keep the tiny C-clips from escaping easily; be careful removing them, as they like to fly away & are difficult to find. Be very gentle with the springs, taking great care not to overstretch them during disassembly; they're calibrated for tension. Note the positions of the tiny washers on the counterweight pins. Before disassembly, mark the end of rotating sleeve and the shaft around which it rotates wioth a scribe so you don't reassemble it 180° out of sync. Use only enough high-temperature grease to coat the inside of the rotating sleeve, and mostly fill the groove on the advancer shaft.. There should be instructions in the KZ1000 manual for dis/re-assembly of the advancer mechanism.
Good Ridin';
slmjim & Z1BEBE
A biker looks at your engine and chrome.
A Rider looks at your odometer and tags.
1973 ('72 builds) Z1 x2
1974 Z1-A x2
1975 Z1-B x2
1993 CB 750 Nighthawk x2
2009 ST1300A
www.kawasaki-z-classik.com
An enthusiast's forum focused exclusively
on all things Z1, Z2 and KZ900.
The following user(s) said Thank You: KZmarcel
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- KZmarcel
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23 Feb 2022 11:08 #862819
by KZmarcel
I'll dive into it, the hardest might be to figure out if my grease is high-temp enough...
WA state, USA
1981 KZ1000 Ltd project for me
kzrider.com/forum/11-projects/617085-kz1000-full-spa#861637
1982 KZ440 Ltd project for my wife
1991 Yamaha 1200 VMax
2005 Kawasaki Vulcan 2000
1971 Buick Riviera boat-tail
2004 Jaguar XJR
1999 Dodge Ram 5.7L Magnum
1977 John Deere 400
Replied by KZmarcel on topic KZ1000 bunch of teardown questions
Right on !The red dust in the R.H engine cover is very likely fine rust particles thrown out from within the advancer mechanism by centrifugal force. It may never have been serviced.
The advancer lives on the end of the crankshaft, indexed by a small pin pressed into the end of the crank re: TDC of cyls. 1-4 and 2-3.. A small amount of grease was applied at the factory to the inside of the rotating sleeve of the advancer, along with the advancer shaft around which the sleeve rotates. The advancer sleeve rotates around the advancer shaft when the counterweights (the small arms held in place by springs) are forced outward by centrifugal force to advance spark timing as engine RPM rises from idle. The factory grease deteriorates with heat & age, leading to sluggish advancer operation or, sometimes, seizing completely.
We'd suggest disassembling, cleaning & re-lubing the advancer mechanism. Work on a comfortable, flat surface, in good light. A towel works well for us, as it will keep the tiny C-clips from escaping easily; be careful removing them, as they like to fly away & are difficult to find. Be very gentle with the springs, taking great care not to overstretch them during disassembly; they're calibrated for tension. Note the positions of the tiny washers on the counterweight pins. Before disassembly, mark the end of rotating sleeve and the shaft around which it rotates wioth a scribe so you don't reassemble it 180° out of sync. Use only enough high-temperature grease to coat the inside of the rotating sleeve, and mostly fill the groove on the advancer shaft.. There should be instructions in the KZ1000 manual for dis/re-assembly of the advancer mechanism.
Good Ridin';
slmjim & Z1BEBE
I'll dive into it, the hardest might be to figure out if my grease is high-temp enough...
WA state, USA
1981 KZ1000 Ltd project for me
kzrider.com/forum/11-projects/617085-kz1000-full-spa#861637
1982 KZ440 Ltd project for my wife
1991 Yamaha 1200 VMax
2005 Kawasaki Vulcan 2000
1971 Buick Riviera boat-tail
2004 Jaguar XJR
1999 Dodge Ram 5.7L Magnum
1977 John Deere 400
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