Kz900 Engine casing crack after slight explosion. No clutch activity now.

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26 Aug 2008 18:12 #234133 by Nahman
Thanks guys for all your help. I'm currently waiting for the outer sprocket cover to arrive. Could you guys help me understand how this works though? I purchased and used a battery charger yesterday. My battery is now fully charged. So I got the bike running (whoo!!) and the engine is running strong. So there is nothing wrong with that. So when I looked I saw that, just like when I tried to use the kick start the clutch pusher rod was spinning also. Am I right in saying that that rod is always spinning? So that means the screw on the clutch actuator was pushing against that rod to engage it? Wow. So when I try to use the kick start the screw on the actuator stops the rod from spinning and allows the motor to start? I dont fully understand how it works, the whole rod, clutch, kick starting relationship.

Any how thanks Patton I took your advice and bought both the replacement pushrod and mushroom. I hope it makes the clutch action somewhat more smooth because as I said before, it was real tough to engage the clutch. A couple more quick questions: How do I remove the pushrod? I tried pulling it when I initially pulled the cover off and didn't come out or go in more than half an inch or so.I tried to after zippy suggested it also. Doesnt budge really. And is there some sort of spring thats supposed to return the rod back to position after its pushed in? How does it move back out after its pushed in by the mushroom?

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26 Aug 2008 18:55 #234139 by RonKZ650
That pushrod arrangement you have there looks like a more or less home made solution. Besides the case you're going to need the entire release mech, mushroom, pushrod and ball bearing at least.
When the kickstarter is kicked it turns the clutch hub, then the clutch if locked turns the clutch basket which in turn turns the engine over, so if your clutch lever is pulled in or the plates removed only the center of the clutch will turn, not the outer basket.
None of your pushrod stuff should spin with the engine. The mushroom may spin just from residual oil drag, then the ball bearing should isolate the rod itself from spinning. The rod pulls right out, but as previously mentioned, you've got serious problems there. Probably the rod has welded itself to the ball and the whole thing has mushroomed to big to pull. It's going to take some work there.

321,000 miles on KZ's that I can remember. Not going to see any more.

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26 Aug 2008 20:05 - 26 Aug 2008 20:11 #234152 by Patton
Nahman wrote:

... help me understand how this works...
dont fully understand how it works, the whole
rod, clutch, kick starting relationship...
is there some sort of spring thats supposed
to return the rod back to position after its
pushed in? How does it move back out after its
pushed in by the mushroom?


The clutch pushrod adjustment is a
routine maintenance item and is
accomplished by loosening the locknut,
turning the screw in clockwise
(or counter-clockwise, depending on
the particular model) until lightly seated
and then loosening the screw 1/2 turn,
then tightening the locknut. This leaves
a small gap between the adjusting screw
and the push rod, so there is no pressure
countering the clutch springs which are
holding the clutch plates together.

The clutch lever when first squeezed
should have a slight easy short pull
(which takes up the pushrod slack via
the worm gear) and then the clutch lever
begins requiring a much firmer squeeze
throughout its remaining travel on toward
and against the handlebar grip. It's the
firm squeeze pulling distance whereby
the interior cable continues activating
the worm gear which pushes the clutch
pushrod to overcome the pressure of the
clutch springs and thereby disengage the clutch.

Upon releasing the handlebar clutch lever,
pressure against the pushrod is relieved,
whereby the natural action of the clutch
springs serves to press the clutch plates
together and thereby engage the clutch.

While squeezing and releasing the handlebar
clutch lever, should be able to sense feel
of the clutch as it disengages (squeezing
the lever) and engages (releasing the lever).

If the clutch pushrod gap has reduced or vanished
(from perfectly normal ordinary gradual wearing
of the clutch plate material), the simple
quick cheap easy fix is often a clutch
pushrod adjustment.

Here it is, straight from Mama Kaw's lips:

"Clutch push rod adjustment -- Need and Purpose"

The FSM (factory service manual) covering
Z1 and KZ900 includes a periodic maintenance
chart requiring clutch push rod adjustment
at 2000 mile (3000 km) intervals and explains
the need therefor in separate text,
which explanation is quoted as follows:

"Besides cable stretch, clutch plate wear
also causes the clutch to go out of adjustment,
with a decrease in push rod play. Due to
this wear, the push rod gradually moves
closer to the clutch release lever
(at the lower end of the clutch cable)
until it touches the adjusting screw.
When the rod is touching the screw and
therefore has no play, the clutch will not
engage fully and clutch slippage will occur.
Note that the clutch push rod does not
necessaily have play just because the
clutch hand lever has play, and so hand
lever play alone cannot be used to
determine whether or not the clutch
requires adjustment."

The FSM covering '77-'79 KZ1000's includes
a periodic maintenance chart requiring
clutch adjustment at 5000 km intervals,
and explains the need therefor in slightly
different language, which explanation
is quoted as follows:

"Clutch plate wear also causes the clutch
to go out of adjustment. This wear causes
the play between the push rod and the
adjusting screw to gradually diminish
until the push rod touches the adjusting screw.
When this play is lost, the clutch will
not engage fully, causing the clutch to slip.
NOTE: Even though the proper amount of play
exists at the clutch lever, clutch lever play
alone cannot be used to determine whether
or not the clutch requires adjustment."

Good Luck! :)

1973 Z1
KZ900 LTD
Last edit: 26 Aug 2008 20:11 by Patton.

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26 Aug 2008 21:39 #234165 by RonKZ650
I'll enter my 2c that will generally be regarded as bull as always, but as I've said before over and over, there is no reason to ever fool with the adjuster on the engine. Even in 160,000 miles plus without adjusting, simply adjusting the cable is ample to keep the clutch working just fine. This is KZ #1, KZ#2 has 80,000 miles, KZ#3 63,000. None have ever f**ked with the adjustment at the engine. So go by the Clammer manual, turn the adjuster on the engine in 34 turns till it feels hard, or out 38.2 turns. Either way it will be piece of junk after attempting adjusting this way. This doesn't help at all if previous owners have "adjusted" unfortunately.

321,000 miles on KZ's that I can remember. Not going to see any more.

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27 Aug 2008 05:14 #234197 by wiredgeorge
I never adjust my clutch except when installing a new cable and my shaft drive will go 195 mph! If you lube the clutch cable, you have to adjust a clutch a whole lot less than a dry cable which quickly stretches. My shafty only goes 193 mph when the clutch cable is dry!

wiredgeorge Motorcycle Carburetors
Mico TX
www.wgcarbs.com
Too many bikes to list!

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27 Aug 2008 07:15 - 27 Aug 2008 07:19 #234218 by RonKZ650
Make all the jokes you like. I never adjust anything but the cable and have zero problems. 165,000 miles plus on original plates and release mech never touched once in that time. It looks like the adjuster on the engine in this case was turned in like 20 turns to take up slack. Maybe the ball bearing is missing? If anyone replaces anything in the clutch at least be sensible. If the clutch was working, then put back together and the adjuster needs to be turned 25 turns in, chances are something is not exactly right somewhere.

321,000 miles on KZ's that I can remember. Not going to see any more.
Last edit: 27 Aug 2008 07:19 by RonKZ650.

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28 Aug 2008 10:53 #234442 by Nahman
Oh...my...gosh!!! Guys I'm really starting to get frustrated now. As of now I have all the parts I think I need: New clutch cable, new output sprocket cover, new needle bearing clutch pusher, new pushrod. So today I went to get down to it. As I wrote before I couldn't remove the clutch pushing rod. So I took off the sprocket cover, the chain the sprocket and the the cover behind that. Luckily I had the bike tilted, because all I found was oil.I didnt snap a pic but I'm sure you guys know what I was looking at from my desciption, the shift linkage and stuff. But from what I saw I couldnt see what was stopping the pushrod and so I couldnt figure what else to do. How am i supposed to get this rod out?

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28 Aug 2008 11:53 #234452 by RonKZ650
You're going to have to remove the clutch cover and clutch to replace the mushroom assuming it's destroyed. You may be able to push the rod out that side of the engine.

321,000 miles on KZ's that I can remember. Not going to see any more.

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28 Aug 2008 12:51 #234463 by Jack
Nahman, when mine broke the pushrod seized inside the case and I had to use a vice grip to pull it out.


Be sure you hone the pushrod shaft as mine had burrs in it from seizing the old pushrod. I used a wire coat hanger with a very tight loop at the end and inserted and wrapped a piece of emery cloth round it.The loop has to be tight and not too much emery cloth as you are working with a 6.85 mm.hole here.

I had the clutch pack out and made sure to hone all the way through the cases from the trans door cover to the clutch housing.

79 KZ 1075 MKll
79 KZ 1500 MKll dragbike
Gone but not forgotten:
3 X 73 Z1's
1 X 74 Z1A
1 X 75 Z1B

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29 Aug 2008 11:21 #234631 by Nahman
anyone know where I can get a 3/8' steel bearing. In like an ordinary store. Home depot didn't have any. I really dont want to buy it online and pay 50cent for it and 6 dollars shipping.

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31 Aug 2008 21:41 #234896 by Nahman
I'm currently in the process of putting everything back together. Is this strange? I was putting on the outside cover and I was having a really tough time. The shifting rod wasnt going through the hole in the case. There wasnt any gunk in there just metal. Are there some variances in the size of shifting rods? Any how I'm going to go to home depot and buy a file and shave it down just a tad. One more question: when screwing the pressure plate spring bolts, how tight should I make them? It seems that when I tighten them almost all the way down there is alot of friction when I turn the clutch with the kick start. But when they are less tight theres less friction. Not sure how tight they were when I unbolted them. There may also be a bit more resistance because alot of oil came out. But I would like to know how much all the same. Will update again when completed...which I hope is by tommorow.

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01 Sep 2008 12:52 #235014 by Nahman
Oh yeah I bought a torque wrench. I'm not trying to do it by feel. The clymers manual doesnt say how much lbs of torque to tighten with.

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