700cc 650 - worthwhile?

So i've been looking at my options, and I'd like to know what everyone thinks. I'm a bit limited on money, so instead of buying a 750 cylinder block to use on my 650, I think I'm gonna go 2mm over, have the head refurbished by APE, get WG to rebuild/rejet my VM's, put pods on them, and put on a kerker exhaust. Does this sound like a good plan? I don't really want to get into different cams/valves and the whole issue that the 700 I buy might need a hone/ring job too.

You are a bit limited on money so you are going to dump $1600-$2000 into your bike?

You and I have different definitions of "limited"

If you are going to do all that, it would cost you no more than $50 more to get a 750 cylinder block, and gain over 100cc additional displacement (810 kit costs the same as 700 kit).

Rule number one:

There's no replacement for displacement

I like Steell's advice.

Also, you could pick up a good running 900 or 1000 motor for $500+/- and then recoupe some of your investment by eBaying your 650 motor. Then there you'd be; bHp and torque on the cheap!
-KR

everything else sounds top of the line
WG not cheaper carb kits
Kerker, not cheaper mac system
head done by APE not cheaper local machine shop
Wisco kit, not just re-ringing old pistons

Why cheap out on the most bang for your buck part of the rebuild?

If you are sending your head to ape, include your 650 cylinders and either the liners from the 750 orrr the whole second set of cylinders.... then they can set you up with a 650 block done out to 810.

Alright, i'm beginning to see the trend lol.

So I should get a set of 750 cylinders, bore out to 810. Should I put 750 intake valves in my 650 head while I'm at it? And would you guys reccomend an oil cooler at this point?

As for sending my cylinders to APE too, is there any benefit to this besides the fact that they're good? I have a good local shop that can bore and hone my cylinders for me.

Oh and how much screwing around to get a 900 engine in my frame?

Or should I just buy this wicked GPz550? www.newfoundlandmotorsports.com/site/viewtopic.php?t=29555

That's a lot of money for a GPz550 :woohoo:
For a thousand bucks more you should be able to get a nice ZRX1200!

Any machinist can bore a cylinder, but if you want maximum hp then APE is the place to go to have it done. The boring part is easy, nothing special there, it's the honing part that makes the difference. Unless the shop does at least hundreds, if not thousands, of cylinder blocks a year, they simply can't afford the equipment to do the honing required to produce the microfinish needed for maximum hp.

APE is real reasonable on their machine work prices, for what it would cost me to have the block bored and honed locally, I can send it to APE and pay the shipping both ways.

APE offers a discount on boring and honing if you purchase the piston kit from them. You can shop around and get the best price on a piston kit, then send the block and kit to APE, but you will only save $20-$30 over buying it from APE.

The owner of APE is a member here (APE Jay), and he'll probably tell you the same thing that I just said

You can put a 900/1000/1100 in your frame, but it's a whole lot of work.

Well for what I'm putting into my KZ, i could prbably buy a ZRX too but I'd like to have an 810 KZ650, it'd certainly be the only one in this neck of the woods, where kz's are rarer than anything. I guess thats why they call our kind nuts steell...

So, I'm decided on the 750 cylinders, seems fairly cheap on ebay. I'm sure in the coming months i'll be able to snag a deal.

Does all the cam chain gear from my 650 transfer to the 750 engine? The sprockets etc? I'm gonna buy an APE tensioner, but does all the other stuff swap? And what years 750 should I be looking at?

And should I get an oil cooler?

I know this is a lot of questions, just want to make sure I dont end up in a sticky situation.

77_650B1 wrote:

Does all the cam chain gear from my 650 transfer to the 750 engine? The sprockets etc? I'm gonna buy an APE tensioner, but does all the other stuff swap? And what years 750 should I be looking at?

If you want to put a 750 block on an early (pre-81) 650 low end you will need a cylinder block off a 1980 KZ 750, that is the only year 750 block that has the provisions for the cam chain idler sprockets (marked in red in the pic below). You need to be absolutely positive that the cylinder block you get has these provisions or it won´t work with the 650 single roller cam chain setup. This particular block just sold on ebay Australia for $60 AU.

Oops, wrong pic, here´s the right one:

.

OK, thanks man, I'll make sure.

I'm sick and i'm tired of hearing the horror stories about machine work. ape is not the only place on this earth that can bore/hone cylinders. It is not rocket science and theres plenty of good equipment out there. And people with the skills and experience to bore anything that comes upon them. That includes blocks, heads, cranks....but most of all i'm sick and tired people and companys conveying the message that they or their place is or are the best best place to get work done and tacking on lots of extra dollars to the small guy and buying bmw's with that money and houses the size of factories. And you know what you get? U get to wait in line to get ....... And everyones dooing it. WOW! might as well dress up like this:kiss:

haha, somebody woke up one the wrong side of the bed this morning. i'm going to use APE for the simple fact that they know KZ's and I'd like to get my head done there. So why not send my block along as well, buy my pistons from them too and get honing done for half price? seems pretty rational to me. I think APE's prices are reasonable actually, since any machine shop is going to charge you $70 an hour or more to do work.

As for quality, with as many people advocating them as APE has, its no wonder they get people's business. And from my own experience, very nice guys to chat with, and always trying to make you a satisfied customer.