KZ_Rage wrote:
Odd... you worry about flushing them out but then you say it isn't a problem... hmmmm, which is it?
Huh?
What are you talking about? Do you read the posted answers? Either you have problems reading, you don't read, or you can't understand what you do read. Which is it? Hmmmmm?
Aluminum doesn't get "chewed up and spit out" [
Oh, horse$hit.
You mean to tell me that if the cam chain is chewing aluminum, that it doesn't fall or get slung into the #2, #3 rods, the cam chain drive sprocket and every other mating surface in sight?
Whom are you kidding?
...it tends to lap under pressure.
Again, *what* are you talking about?
I'm pretty certain you've got a big library of magazines, but do you have you any practical knowledge gained by actually working on these motors?
Aluminum "lapping" is an abrasive process performed with and by an OXIDE of aluminum - a molecule - which you're gonna find is present in a motorcycle crankase in the PPM range and as an abrasive issue is way down the list of potential problems.
The form of aluminum found in crankcases is atomic or metallic aluminum - and since it is far more ductile than the steel parts it contacts, is far more likely to *metallize* - cake up at contact points due to pressure, temperature and dielectric varience - something it rarely ever does - and then most often in high performance - high temperature and pressure instances.
If what you're proposing had the *slightest* basis in everyday, normal usage fact, then every gear, bearing, race and bushing would have a nicely metallized aluminum coating at every mating surface instead of the aluminum winding up where it does: in suspension in the oil, and then precipitate IN THE PAN.
Do you want that to get in-between two surfaces that require a clearance tolerance? Not me. The bigger threat to long trouble free life is the larger micron stuff. You hope the filter gets it but it gets to ride a bit before that happens. Want to have it ride a while in the rings while if scores the walls for a while? Not me.
Oh this is rich.
Motors run every day in every circumstance with aluminum in suspension. And scads of other stuff. If it didn't, motors wouldn't wear out, but they do.
It's a fact. Get used to it.
I think your "flush with cheap oil" procedure has been proved inadequate as the pan was still full of chips after he had drained it.
"Proved"? By who? You? Hardly.
Your problem is obvious; you think too much and pull motors apart too not nearly enough. Here's a little secret for your hip pocket: short of NASA pulling up and dropping off a #15 clean room and a pile of eggheads to wipe and polish every part as your expert pinkies assemble it, it's gonna have some leftover crap in it. People a lot smarter and a lot more experienced than you have used that method for quite some time, and it's worked pretty well until now.
Given the alternatives, I'll stick with their experience.
Changing the oil is going to make you feel like you did something but the potential for debris in the engine causing a problem will still be there.
Oh, Puuuuuhlese.
The very agent of the motor's demise is MANUFACTURED INTO IT - it's called metal. If you cleaned the thing like a space probe, fer chrissakes, by the time the new rings seat, you ALREADY HAVE METAL IN SUSPENSION.
Think changing the oil doesn't have a bearing on that?
My statement of taking it out of the bike is so you can flush it better assembled if you are going the half-step method of assuring removal of the debris versus a complete tear down.
Oh yeah? And who's gonna help pull it from the frame? And what kind of rig are you going to mount that heavy bastard in so you can rotate and flush it about all three axes to accomplish this miracle of modern surfactant magic of yours? And who's bathtub are you gonna catch all these gallons of solvent in?
All great theory. Short on practicality.
The fact is, whether you agree with it or not, that these motors have been partially torn down, flushed to some acceptable degree and reassembled to run trouble free for YEARS - your theoretical positing makes for great barstool harangues, but doesn't get the bike back on the road one minute quicker or one dime cheaper - a recurring topic on this forum, if you haven't noticed...
Lots of folks were saying how lucky he was it didn't do any real damage but I didn't see where he had checked the cylinder walls yet.
And with a "Hiyo Silver!" you charge into the thread three weeks into the exchange on a white steed to correct all our mistakes and inform us that we're in danger of ignoring vitally important topics?
I'm impressed.
Post edited by: Pterosaur, at: 2006/07/15 03:18