Painting a KZ900 - Advice Needed

All,

So I have been getting quotes for painting my project bike's tank, tail, side covers, and front fender. Going to keep it somewhat original looking, but change the A4 Diamond Green to 2005 Jaguar Racing Green and painting the stripes instead of using the decals. I am also chaging the lime green colored stripe to silver. So my quotes are ranging from $1200 - $1900 to do this. Seems a bit high, but who am I to judge..... So in my previous life, I used to work at Muscle Car Restorations where we did very high end resotorations and custom cars. I did everything thing there except lay the base, clear and wet sand the car. So I am fairly used to some level of quality body work.

This got me thinking, I always farm out my painting projects on my cars and bikes, and perhaps that should change. I have a place that I can build a makeshift cross draft paintbooth. I would have to pick up a couple of guns and tips/needles. I have all the other body working tools needed. Of course, I would need to pickup a full course of paint, primers, fillers, paper, clear, polish, etc... So my questions are:

1. Any recommendations on guns/kits? Looking at a kit from Devilbiss which is their 2 gun Finishline kit which is available through Eastwood and TCPTools.

2. My stock paint is in good, but faded/old condition. Do you think it would be OK to just sand and level that and paint over it or do I really need to take it all the way down to bare metal? Does anyone know what the stock paint was? I looks like laquer based paint to me....

3. So with three colors, anyone have a WAG or idea of cost for a good quality urethane or enamel (base & clear)? Is this $500 or $200 or even $1000 dollars worth of material? Also, do you think a quart of the base color is enough to do the pieces I had listed above for multiple coat coverage?

Any advice would be appreciated.

Cory

NakedFun wrote: All,

So I have been getting quotes for painting my project bike's tank, tail, side covers, and front fender. Going to keep it somewhat original looking, but change the A4 Diamond Green to 2005 Jaguar Racing Green and painting the stripes instead of using the decals. I am also chaging the lime green colored stripe to silver. So my quotes are ranging from $1200 - $1900 to do this. Seems a bit high, but who am I to judge..... So in my previous life, I used to work at Muscle Car Restorations where we did very high end resotorations and custom cars. I did everything thing there except lay the base, clear and wet sand the car. So I am fairly used to some level of quality body work.

This got me thinking, I always farm out my painting projects on my cars and bikes, and perhaps that should change. I have a place that I can build a makeshift cross draft paintbooth. I would have to pick up a couple of guns and tips/needles. I have all the other body working tools needed. Of course, I would need to pickup a full course of paint, primers, fillers, paper, clear, polish, etc... So my questions are:

1. Any recommendations on guns/kits? Looking at a kit from Devilbiss which is their 2 gun Finishline kit which is available through Eastwood and TCPTools.

2. My stock paint is in good, but faded/old condition. Do you think it would be OK to just sand and level that and paint over it or do I really need to take it all the way down to bare metal? Does anyone know what the stock paint was? I looks like laquer based paint to me....

3. So with three colors, anyone have a WAG or idea of cost for a good quality urethane or enamel (base & clear)? Is this $500 or $200 or even $1000 dollars worth of material? Also, do you think a quart of the base color is enough to do the pieces I had listed above for multiple coat coverage?

Any advice would be appreciated.

Cory

I've painted a few cars in "garage" booths, most recently this '69 Mustang from start to finish. To prove I could do it on a budget, I used a Harbor Freight gun and Summit Racing Paint. It was a basecoat clearcoat job and turned out awesome. 5 years or so ago this was done and up until I sold it paint held up beautifully, the new owner shows this car on a weekly basis. I think 2 quarts tops and a single stage enamel would work fine for you. Check out Summit.

You know I have been a Summit customer for eons, but never bought paint from them. I'll take a look thanks.

Cory

My brother has a good gun and a Habor freight 20$ gun and they spray about the same . He was really surprised the cheap one was so good. Cory try Welle auto in Columbia Heights or Blaine they are the best local suppliers around the cities. Napa warehouse store by the fair grounds also has paint.
Bob

Bob,

Yep they are near my work with their Columbia Heights location. I deal with them a fair bit and I know they have quite the body supply stock. I had read posts on the HF guns, and posts after 2010 seem to imply that the guns have changed since 2010 and they are worse. Don't know if it is true or not....

Cory

Back in my younger years all we ever used as spray guns was Devilbiss, they were the top of the line spray guns back then, at least you know that the company has been around for a long time and I doubt that you will be dissapointed with the performance of the spray gun.

+1...I use both Binks and De Vilbiss and I they are great guns. I am partial to gravity feed guns as that is how I learned years ago.

Oh definitely a gravity feed HVLP as that is what I am used to. Devilbiss and Eastwood branded guns are top on the list.

Cory

my exwifes husband has been involved with custom painting and production work for 35 years owns 6 body shops

i did some airbrush work and have helped him on a couple jobs. we had a discussion about what paint gun I would need for a few paint jobs a year (1 a month) he advised me on not refinancing the farm for a paint gun. the only reason to buy the higher end guns as with any tool is for production work most people dont buy snap on tools to do occasional work. Paint Guns are no different

Case and point he bought me a high end airbrush well over 300.00 ( I have always used the workhorse brush I could find deals on for 59. to 79.00 (paasche VL) The iwaata is an awesome air brush but not using it every day it takes a complete overhaul each time I use it. and isn't as good as my workhorse for some things and better at others

I have sprayed with his paint gun and it sprays beautifully it has the inverted cup so it feeds at any angle super easy to clean etc...

remember the old attage it's not the violin it's the violinist. harbor freaght 2.0 nozzle gun atomizes the paint well lays down as smooth as any gun I have used

cleaning it takes a little more effort because I dont use it every day

I clear with the 1.3 nozzle HB gun for motorcycles a little hard to get the volume of paint but
it burns in and lays cleaner than pouring the clear on with the 2.0

assuming your compressor will handle it (mine is my week link)

I had 600.00 to buy a gun with and ended up with 3 harbor freight guns and plenty of product a steak dinner. at his advice 5 paint jobs later I neglected my clear gun did a total cleanout cleanup and its is back in business


ok now I have shared my gun experience lets talk paint

I started out with kirker paints the most expensive clear they sell is 79.00 plus catalyst right at 110.00 plus tax

first paint job was a practice paint job on a buddys bike worked well then painted my green bike
did a few more using combination of systems

bought kirker base coat house of Kolor metal flake, and accent color and my trusty ol top of the line clear.
beatuful paint job 6 months later clear has yellowed talked to one of the painter at the shop he tells me the clear they use on silver and white is a little over 200 a gallon plus catylist

I have switched to PPG base coats house of Kolor accents (and wicked) the cost of supplies has doubled but if you shop wisely TCP global and auto body depot on ebay (same company) bought a quart of PPG Grabber blue un reduced 50.00ish dollars same quart would be between 160.00 and 300.00 here locally

I have been lucky and able to get a small quanities of over mixes for pennies on the dollar
remember a pint makes a quart mixed plenty to lay a base coat on tank tail side covers and fairing.

moral of the story no matter what you spend on a gun it all comes down to how well you use it and what materials you use the cheaper paints are decent and the high end paint is well...high end as long as your laying it that way.

reminds me of my cousin who is an extremely talented guitar player used to make my fender squire
scream nobody would believe he was playing 100 guitar

keep a cheap gun clean buy plenty of diposable cups and buy quality paint and you will have better results as long as you play it well

keep an expensive gun clean buy mediocre meterial get medocre results

and we havent even discussed color sanding and buffing lol

hope this helps

I was very suprised that he didnt tell me you get what you pay for when I asked him to get me gun like his. He told me in his words "if your using it everyday I'll order you one but if its gonna sit around your wasting your money"

Thanks, that was a fantastic post. I have heard old painters say that the quality of the paint breaks down to 60% prep, 20% skill, 15% material and 5% equipment. I have seen some fantastic paint on a small scale, come out of a rattle can with the right guy doing it. I have also seen a talented guy from college paint a car with GLOSS BLACK single stage Rustoleum from their gallon cans that was damn near show worthy. I hear what your saying, and may stop by HF and pick up their 2 gun kit. I am also thinking abou that 3M PPS cup system for ease and spill protection.

I am working on finding colors, and was just on TCP Global's site as they have a green that is really close to the Jaguar Racing Green I was looking for. I also need to be thinking about pin striping masking tape so I can paint the stripes into the tank.

Cory

When I said gravity feed, I should also have said non-HVLP. +1 on what Ram said about quality paint, I use PPG with reactive thinners. The other thing I have noticed is that some colours are more expensive than others...yellow and red are at the top of the list, when I first needed a rich yellow I almost dropped my drawers when I heard the price for a pint pot ($76)

Why not HVLP? When I was shooting sealers, fillers, and etching primers with a gravity HVLP and a 1.8-2.0 tip, got a good coverage and even layout. Is there something different when shooting base and clear with a HVLP?

Cory