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KZ650 " Wandedring" Won't track straight
- mrgem
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05 Oct 2018 17:02 - 05 Oct 2018 17:06 #791894
by mrgem
KZ650 " Wandedring" Won't track straight was created by mrgem
Bought a KZ650 C2 last spring that had been converted into a cafe racer with rear set foot controls and a Kerker 4-into-1. The bike hadn't run in years and needed just about every kind of maintenance a neglected 40-year old bike would need. Aside from riding it out of my garage for a couple of blocks, I've never really ridden it. When I bought it, I wanted to put the bike back to stock as close as I could, so I turned it over to a friend who does motorcycle wrenching as a part-time gig. He specializes in early Z1 and KZ maintenance and is very familiar with 70s 4-cylinder Kawasakis.
He's run into a very mysterious problem with the bike's handling and I am hoping that you all can offer some suggestions.
The bike wanders down the road. After riding the bike, i could tell there was definitely some drag in the front steering. I had the wrench replace the steering head bearings with a set of proper conical bearings. While the steering is no longer "notchy" like it was, the bike is still not stable going down the road.
My friend has done some informal inspection of the fork tubes and they seem to be straight -- although he hasn't pulled them apart and checked them off the bike.. He also checked for any obvious signs of the bike having been hit hard and damaging the frame. He found nothing other than the fact that the side stand was relocated to accommodate the Kerker. The PO also hacked off the center stand mounting tabs for the same reason.
The tires on the bike have plenty of tread but were old and the rubber seemed quite brittle. So we replaced the front tire. No change. We haven't changed the back tire yet but that may be the next step.
Any ideas aside from the possibility of demonic possession?
Thanks for your help.
He's run into a very mysterious problem with the bike's handling and I am hoping that you all can offer some suggestions.
The bike wanders down the road. After riding the bike, i could tell there was definitely some drag in the front steering. I had the wrench replace the steering head bearings with a set of proper conical bearings. While the steering is no longer "notchy" like it was, the bike is still not stable going down the road.
My friend has done some informal inspection of the fork tubes and they seem to be straight -- although he hasn't pulled them apart and checked them off the bike.. He also checked for any obvious signs of the bike having been hit hard and damaging the frame. He found nothing other than the fact that the side stand was relocated to accommodate the Kerker. The PO also hacked off the center stand mounting tabs for the same reason.
The tires on the bike have plenty of tread but were old and the rubber seemed quite brittle. So we replaced the front tire. No change. We haven't changed the back tire yet but that may be the next step.
Any ideas aside from the possibility of demonic possession?
Thanks for your help.
Last edit: 05 Oct 2018 17:06 by mrgem.
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- Nessism
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05 Oct 2018 17:23 #791895
by Nessism
Replied by Nessism on topic KZ650 " Wandedring" Won't track straight
I'd check wheel alignment using the string technique. Check google for guidelines. Seems that something is off.
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- SWest
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- 10 22 2014
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05 Oct 2018 18:36 #791897
by SWest
Replied by SWest on topic KZ650 " Wandedring" Won't track straight
I'd change the wheel bearings just for SOP. Could be it or just part of it. Are the forks leaking? If so I'd change the seals and boots and a good cleanup inside as well as out. If the fluid level is mismatched or nonexistent, that could make it unstable too.
Poor handling up front can often be generated from the rear. Bad tire etc. even chain.
Also the forks can be twisted in the trees a touch. Doesn't take much and sighting the front tire and gap in the upper tree and how it is aligned with the center back bone of the frame will tell you that. Sometimes I've had to put my front tire up against a post and rack it a touch to get it straight again.
Sounds like you have the right idea.
PICS? NEED PICS :woohoo:
Steve
Poor handling up front can often be generated from the rear. Bad tire etc. even chain.
Also the forks can be twisted in the trees a touch. Doesn't take much and sighting the front tire and gap in the upper tree and how it is aligned with the center back bone of the frame will tell you that. Sometimes I've had to put my front tire up against a post and rack it a touch to get it straight again.
Sounds like you have the right idea.
PICS? NEED PICS :woohoo:
Steve
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- DOHC
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- Those Doe-Hawks really go!
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05 Oct 2018 19:43 #791900
by DOHC
'78 Z1-R in blue , '78 Z1-R in black, '78 Z1-R in pieces
My dad's '74 Z1
'00 ZRX1100
Replied by DOHC on topic KZ650 " Wandedring" Won't track straight
I would check the swing arm pivot bearings. I think the c2 should have roller bearings as opposed to bronze bushings? Anyway, play in the swing arm pivot could certainly make it squirrelly.
'78 Z1-R in blue , '78 Z1-R in black, '78 Z1-R in pieces
My dad's '74 Z1
'00 ZRX1100
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- TexasKZ
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06 Oct 2018 07:02 - 06 Oct 2018 07:20 #791915
by TexasKZ
1982 KZ1000 LTD parts donor
1981 KZ1000 LTD awaiting resurrection
2000 ZRX1100 not ridden enough
Replied by TexasKZ on topic KZ650 " Wandedring" Won't track straight
I would add to the list, bad shocks.
Did the po modify the frame at all? If he removed the rear of the sub frame under the seat and did not install a solid brace between the two sides, you may be getting some excessive frame flex at the rear.
Assuming i did not see something obvious like a broken frame weld or missing shock, my list would look like this--
Air pressure in the tires
Tire age and condition - both of them
Steering bearing condition, lubrication and torque
Forks - alignment, straightness, fluid condition and level, seals and bushings
Shocks - blown, leaky seals. If they are original, throw them away.
Swingarm bearings or bushings - wear and lubrication
Wheel and frame alignment.
Check motor mount bolts. Are they all present and properly torqued?
Since it has been cafed, check the frame for dodgy modifications
Did the po modify the frame at all? If he removed the rear of the sub frame under the seat and did not install a solid brace between the two sides, you may be getting some excessive frame flex at the rear.
Assuming i did not see something obvious like a broken frame weld or missing shock, my list would look like this--
Air pressure in the tires
Tire age and condition - both of them
Steering bearing condition, lubrication and torque
Forks - alignment, straightness, fluid condition and level, seals and bushings
Shocks - blown, leaky seals. If they are original, throw them away.
Swingarm bearings or bushings - wear and lubrication
Wheel and frame alignment.
Check motor mount bolts. Are they all present and properly torqued?
Since it has been cafed, check the frame for dodgy modifications
1982 KZ1000 LTD parts donor
1981 KZ1000 LTD awaiting resurrection
2000 ZRX1100 not ridden enough
Last edit: 06 Oct 2018 07:20 by TexasKZ.
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- slmjim+Z1BEBE
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- Enjoy Life! IT HAS AN EXPIRATION DATE!
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06 Oct 2018 07:10 #791917
by slmjim+Z1BEBE
A biker looks at your engine and chrome.
A Rider looks at your odometer and tags.
1973 ('72 builds) Z1 x2
1974 Z1-A x2
1975 Z1-B x2
1993 CB 750 Nighthawk x2
2009 ST1300A
www.kawasaki-z-classik.com
An enthusiast's forum focused exclusively
on all things Z1, Z2 and KZ900.
Replied by slmjim+Z1BEBE on topic KZ650 " Wandedring" Won't track straight
All of the above.
Plus, even tapered steering stem bearings will cause wandering if they're torqued too tight.
Good Ridin'
slmjim & Z1BEBE
Plus, even tapered steering stem bearings will cause wandering if they're torqued too tight.
Good Ridin'
slmjim & Z1BEBE
A biker looks at your engine and chrome.
A Rider looks at your odometer and tags.
1973 ('72 builds) Z1 x2
1974 Z1-A x2
1975 Z1-B x2
1993 CB 750 Nighthawk x2
2009 ST1300A
www.kawasaki-z-classik.com
An enthusiast's forum focused exclusively
on all things Z1, Z2 and KZ900.
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- martin_csr
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06 Oct 2018 07:20 - 06 Oct 2018 07:21 #791918
by martin_csr
Replied by martin_csr on topic KZ650 " Wandedring" Won't track straight
By mrgem: ... He found nothing other than the fact that the side stand was relocated to accommodate the Kerker.
The muffler is on the left side? As for the frame, check to see if the steering stop peg is bent. even if it is, that doesn't necessarily mean the frame is bent.
Another check. stand in front of the motorcycle x feet away to see if the front end looks crooked. Mine was obviously akilter & I found that the upper triple was bent. I checked it on a glass table >> it rocked when pushing down on a corner. the replacement only moved a tad. There are various ways to check the fork tubes.
...
The muffler is on the left side? As for the frame, check to see if the steering stop peg is bent. even if it is, that doesn't necessarily mean the frame is bent.
Another check. stand in front of the motorcycle x feet away to see if the front end looks crooked. Mine was obviously akilter & I found that the upper triple was bent. I checked it on a glass table >> it rocked when pushing down on a corner. the replacement only moved a tad. There are various ways to check the fork tubes.
...
Last edit: 06 Oct 2018 07:21 by martin_csr.
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- hardrockminer
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06 Oct 2018 08:17 #791924
by hardrockminer
I have several restored bikes along with a 2006 Goldwing with a sidecar. My wife has a 2019 Suzuki DR 650 for on and off road.
Replied by hardrockminer on topic KZ650 " Wandedring" Won't track straight
Measure the length of the fork springs. They should be the same length and within the KHI spec. If not....get new ones.
I have several restored bikes along with a 2006 Goldwing with a sidecar. My wife has a 2019 Suzuki DR 650 for on and off road.
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- mrgem
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06 Oct 2018 10:21 #791929
by mrgem
Replied by mrgem on topic KZ650 " Wandedring" Won't track straight
Thanks to all for your suggestions.
Couple of things: If the sing arm bearings/bushings are shot -- shouldn't I be able to detect that by putting it up on a jack and checking for play? And second, is there a tutorial somewhere (YouTube?) on how to check wheel alignment?
Thanks again to all who've offered their advice!
Couple of things: If the sing arm bearings/bushings are shot -- shouldn't I be able to detect that by putting it up on a jack and checking for play? And second, is there a tutorial somewhere (YouTube?) on how to check wheel alignment?
Thanks again to all who've offered their advice!
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- OKC_Kent
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14 Oct 2018 10:30 #792296
by OKC_Kent
Oklahoma City, OK
78 KZ650 B2 82,000+ miles
Replied by OKC_Kent on topic KZ650 " Wandedring" Won't track straight
Youtube has many videos of the string alignment process.
Oklahoma City, OK
78 KZ650 B2 82,000+ miles
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