78 Z1R upgrades

redhawk4 wrote:

z1kzonly wrote:

Nola wrote:

z1kzonly wrote:

531blackbanshee wrote: curious as to why you would put bronze pivot bushing in place of the needle bearings ????

leon

Leon, he might not be aware that the later year KZ swing arms have needle bearings already?

Correct sir.

Cool Nola. What a Score you got with that motorcycle! Good Luck with it all! I might be wrong with the 78's.
But the 80 Z1R had a double wall reinforcement up at the steering head coming down in the down tubes?
And a little history about the Z1R's. No one bought them in 78, they were called ugly. The Factory had too much inventory. Dealers still had new ones in stock to sell 2 & 3 years after their introduction. That's why there was not a 1979 Z1R.
Then they changed up the 1980. Different sized tank, 19" front rim. But that's about all I know about them.
Your off to a GREAT start!
Enjoy it!

It is strange to me how the Z1R is so popular now, because as you rightly say they were really poor sellers at the time, which is why they came up with putting the Turbo's on them to move them out of the showrooms. I really didn't like them back in 78, much preferred the normal KZ1000. However nearly 40 years later I find them much more appealing than I did in 78, I still recall looking at one in the dealer showroom and calling my friend over" look a Z1R" in those days just the fact it was a 1000cc bike was cause for excitement, but it was not really appealing to me. Perhaps it was ahead of it's time, we certainly weren't used to the "square look" back then and I guess others felt the same way based on sales. Am I right in thinking that as the 78 sold so slowly, there is no 79 model?

I'm not the expert, but while the Z1R was one year only...78...there was a Z1R 2....it was available in 1980 in the US. It was similar in appearance but better handling, and a better motor.

At least that's my understanding.

i have only seen z1r-II's that were european for 79.
my '80 KZ1000-D3 Z1-R has z1r side cover emblems and no -II anywhere on anything title included.
but i have seen 79's that have the -II and they are also red/maroon

the u.s. didn't get a z1r in 79
according to the information on
www.zedder.com/msg1.htm
there were 3308 '80 KZ1000-D3 Z1-R produced
and 17291 '78 KZ1000-D1 Z1-R produced
but no listing for the '79 kz1000-d2 z1r-II

so i would be cusrious to know the proudction #'s of the 79's

leon

Nola wrote:

swest wrote: A episode of CHIPS Ponch lost one to a old lady on a game show.
Steve

So funny, the day I bought it, my buddy and neighbor calls me and says come over....and shows me the very end of that episode....lol

I never liked that toothy son of a Benedict. He was full of himself and still is. I watched for the bikes. It was a lame show IMO. I was a Adam 12 fan. :lol:
Didn't the R stand for race?
Steve

here in these pics you can see the mount i was talking about.the peg mounts to it and the header mounts to it.





leon

No eBay APP ID and/or Cert ID defined in Kunena configurationThis link to a mint restored Z1R might help you with some pointers, the eBay pictures are very helpful for research purposes, save them to a file for future reference, I've done that for some of my bikes,


,
Currently it has a bid of $19,500 on it, incredible for a bike they couldn't get anyone to buy in it's day. Traditionally classics have always been vehicles that were highly cherished when new. I really don't understand it, not to knock the PO's bike or anyone else's, but really any vehicle that is rare only because people chose not to buy it when it was being made, just shouldn't be worth that sort of money. When you watch the classic car auctions, they are really specific in terms of years and models that really fetch big money, To those not really in the know, like me, you see two identical vehicles, but one goes for 3 or 4 times the price of the other, because it was the one to have. It seems to me only a 1980 Z1R should be particularly valuable because that is more desirable than the 78 which had some fundamental problems like the 18" front wheel causing instability and under sized gas tank, all of which made it unpopular in its day.

Fair play on this one though, whoever restored it certainly looks to have done a fantastic job.

531blackbanshee wrote: here in these pics you can see the mount i was talking about.the peg mounts to it and the header mounts to it.

leon

Thanks again Leon, no I don't have the adjustable mount In the pic...I'm gonna order a kerker full system...and sort the mount once it arrives.
Thanks again for taking the time
Cheers

redhawk4 wrote: Currently it has a bid of $19,500 on it, incredible for a bike they couldn't get anyone to buy in it's day. Traditionally classics have always been vehicles that were highly cherished when new. I really don't understand it, not to knock the PO's bike or anyone else's, but really any vehicle that is rare only because people chose not to buy it when it was being made, just shouldn't be worth that sort of money. When you watch the classic car auctions, they are really specific in terms of years and models that really fetch big money

Plumouth Superbird, Dodge Charger Daytona and other simillar high end muscle cars were considered ugly, and having obscene amounts of power and went unsold for a long time. Owing their rarity to folks hating their looks and price.
Look at a Z1, normal bland abused examples arent hard to find, still cheap too. Finding a Z1R or MKII in decent shape will cost you, both were considered ugly and undesirable.

No eBay APP ID and/or Cert ID defined in Kunena configurationX

redhawk4 wrote: This link to a mint restored Z1R might help you with some pointers, the eBay pictures are very helpful for research purposes, save them to a file for future reference, I've done that for some of my bikes,


,
Currently it has a bid of $19,500 on it, incredible for a bike they couldn't get anyone to buy in it's day. Traditionally classics have always been vehicles that were highly cherished when new. I really don't understand it, not to knock the PO's bike or anyone else's, but really any vehicle that is rare only because people chose not to buy it when it was being made, just shouldn't be worth that sort of money. When you watch the classic car auctions, they are really specific in terms of years and models that really fetch big money, To those not really in the know, like me, you see two identical vehicles, but one goes for 3 or 4 times the price of the other, because it was the one to have. It seems to me only a 1980 Z1R should be particularly valuable because that is more desirable than the 78 which had some fundamental problems like the 18" front wheel causing instability and under sized gas tank, all of which made it unpopular in its day.

Fair play on this one though, whoever restored it certainly looks to have done a fantastic job.

I saw that on EBay, I would suspect that the bid of 19500, is a friend of his...at 19500, the reserve hasn't been met.according to the ad...I would guess the owner is one of these guys that thinks it's worth far more than it is.....I would be very suprised of he gets more than 10-12 thousand for that bike, impressive as it is.....they are only worth what someone will pay.
As far as desirability...who knows why the 78 is more sought after, the 80 handled better and had the better motor....but beauty is in the eye of the beholder. As far as me, the monetary value is of no concern, i see it as rare and beautiful and that's why I snapped it up....in the end, its a motorcycle and meant to be ridden, and that's what I'm looking forward to!


Cheers

As I said originally I would have bought yours in a heartbeat at the price you paid and for more money too I wouldn't rule out buying one if the opportunity arose, although if I'm going to the "square look" I'd more likely go with the GPz ELR later model, but it all depends on price.and what you get lucky with.

The Z1R's are nice bikes, I just feel there are some who are mistakenly jacking up the values without understanding the bike's history and like wise buyers who are being drawn in by misinterpreting the perceived rarity too. .

I thought that about the one on ebay and whether that was a real bid. Unbelievable to think the reserve could be higher. It could also be a case of the asking price being related to how much was spent restoring it, as opposed to real world value.

Nola wrote: .I just assumed the brakes would be shite....

I think the Z1R is a joy to ride in stock form, even today, but I have to say that I find the front brakes to be disappointing. On my bike the brakes feel wooden and crappy, and the amount of bite is pretty minimal. I don't know how much is due to the cabled master cylinder, but I've done everything I can do with the stock parts, other than switch to a more aggressive pad. I'm using EBC pads and I'm not impressed.

If you're interested in keeping the stock appearance, here is some info. Most Kawasakis from 77 through 80 used the same caliper body (KZ650, ZK750, KZ1000, maybe others), and should all be interchangeable. Nearly all of them used a 42mm piston, but the '78 Z1R (and '78 KZ650-D2) used a 38mm piston. A smaller piston requires more force at the lever. Also, the 79 and 80 KZ1000s added ceramic insulators on the end of the pistons, to thermally insulate the piston from the pad. See non-insulated vs. insulated . This was required when they switched from organic to metallic compounds. Officially you are not supposed to use metallic pads with the older non-insulated caliper pistons, which is why I put those organic EBC pads in my bike.

So if you can find a set of 79 or 80 kZ1000 calipers, they will have bigger pistons which should reduce lever effort, and you can run metallic pads with more bite. This may not be up the level of a modern 4-pot monoblock caliper, but it should certainly be a step up from the stock '78 Z1R setup, and will look 100% original.

Also, if you end up rebuilding the front master cylinder, this post might be helpful.
www.kzrider.com/forum/5-chassis/569907-z...build-kit-substitute

As for a swingarm upgrade, a Calfab aluminum unit was the cool upgrade back in the day, and MotoGPWerks claims to be making modern reproductions. www.motogpwerks.com/kawasaki-gallery

If you have any other Z1R specific questions, such as missing bits and pieces or electrical issues, I can probably help...

redhawk4 wrote: It is strange to me how the Z1R is so popular now... ...Perhaps it was ahead of it's time, we certainly weren't used to the "square look" back then

I think the reason I'm drawn to the Z1R is the fact that the styling was so out of place for its time. It was all sharp angles in a time of soft curves. I think it's the wackiness of it that I find so endearing. That and the fact that it really is a well executed design, in that it all ties together so well; Cowl into tank into seat into tail. Anyway, with three of them I'm committed now...

dohc wrote:

Nola wrote: .I just assumed the brakes would be shite....

I think the Z1R is a joy to ride in stock form, even today, but I have to say that I find the front brakes to be disappointing. On my bike the brakes feel wooden and crappy, and the amount of bite is pretty minimal. I don't know how much is due to the cabled master cylinder, but I've done everything I can do with the stock parts, other than switch to a more aggressive pad. I'm using EBC pads and I'm not impressed.

If you're interested in keeping the stock appearance, here is some info. Most Kawasakis from 77 through 80 used the same caliper body (KZ650, ZK750, KZ1000, maybe others), and should all be interchangeable. Nearly all of them used a 42mm piston, but the '78 Z1R (and '78 KZ650-D2) used a 38mm piston. A smaller piston requires more force at the lever. Also, the 79 and 80 KZ1000s added ceramic insulators on the end of the pistons, to thermally insulate the piston from the pad. See non-insulated vs. insulated . This was required when they switched from organic to metallic compounds. Officially you are not supposed to use metallic pads with the older non-insulated caliper pistons, which is why I put those organic EBC pads in my bike.

So if you can find a set of 79 or 80 kZ1000 calipers, they will have bigger pistons which should reduce lever effort, and you can run metallic pads with more bite. This may not be up the level of a modern 4-pot monoblock caliper, but it should certainly be a step up from the stock '78 Z1R setup, and will look 100% original.

Also, if you end up rebuilding the front master cylinder, this post might be helpful.
www.kzrider.com/forum/5-chassis/569907-z...build-kit-substitute

As for a swingarm upgrade, a Calfab aluminum unit was the cool upgrade back in the day, and MotoGPWerks claims to be making modern reproductions. www.motogpwerks.com/kawasaki-gallery

If you have any other Z1R specific questions, such as missing bits and pieces or electrical issues, I can probably help...

Thanks for all the Info Dohc, I'm going to have the calipers rebuilt, braided lines, and whatever are the most agressive pads I can get installed, and then see how that works for me.

I'm going to keep the stock swingarm, for originality.....and thanks for the offer of advice! I'm sure il take you up on it.

Cheers