Help identifying starter clutch differences

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10 May 2010 15:58 - 10 May 2010 15:59 #367087 by OnlyK
Hi Guys,
I've been a long time reader, but this is my first Post. Its nice to have a community
of like minded riders to bounce ideas and questions off of.

I need a little expert advice on starter clutches. I acquired a 1978 KZ1000-A2 from a family member and it needed some TLC.
I pretty well have the aftermarker items/modifications removed, (Seat, fairing, bags, handlebars etc.) and I'm about one small fix away from the first ride.
I was told when I got the bike that the starter ran but wouldn't crank the engine. I assumed the started clutch was the issue, and finally decided to bite the bullet and
remove the cover to check things out. No difficulty in getting the cover, rotor, and starter clutch off but once I pulled the large gear, I noticed the dampener behind the large
gear was offcenter, and had worn very thin in the flat area. The bronze thrust washers on both sides of the gear are both worn thin.
The clutch rollers look fine, as does the needle bearing. The shoulder on the gear shows no visible wear at all. So I decided
to replace the dampener, and all the thrust washers. In looking at the online parts diagrams, I see that what I have seems to be a mix-n-match of the 1978 and 1979 designs.
My bike came apart ( inside to outside ) with Large rubber/metal damperner, bronze thrust washer, large gear (and inner needle bearing) another bronze thrust washer.
This matches the 1979 diagram the 1978 does NOT SHOW a bronze inner thrust washer. From the best I can tell I have the dampener from the 1978 diagram, with the remaining parts from the 1979 system.

SO My Question is...
The parts seem to be correct, as the large gear has a recess that the thrust washer fits into snuggly. But I am worried why the dampener shifted and why the thrust washers are wearing.
Does anyone know how to identify the various pieces, and how I can tell the right combination to go back together with ?

One other thing is that the crank end DOES NOT have a slot for the woodruff key, and neither does the rotor. It does look like the rotor had been spinning a small amount on the crank at some point. The bolt was reasonably tight when I removed it. and I did have to use the bolt in the center to get it loose.

KZ1000-A2 ,KZ1000-B2, 79 KZ1300, 72 H1, 84 GPZ900R and too many KX's to count!
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Last edit: 10 May 2010 15:59 by OnlyK.

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10 May 2010 17:14 #367108 by keith1
Replied by keith1 on topic Help identifying starter clutch differences
a couple of things....the 78 has a funky looking washer on the backside of the big gear.....i will post a pic in a few...i think i have one around here....those rubber /metal dampers come in 3 sizes....look for 1,2,or 3 stars embossed in the rubber part somehwere...the manual shows how to measure which one you need....78 does not have the cut-out for the key...i would get new springs and spring ends...
here is a link to clutch diagnosis and parts
redlinecycle.com/Starter%20Clutch%20Tech.html

do a little reading and locktite(red)the rotor bolt with a small impact or breaker bar....i have rebuilt a few and the only problem i ever had was that damn bolt coming loose that holds the rotor on......g/l.....hope this helps....

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10 May 2010 19:46 #367140 by MFolks
Replied by MFolks on topic Help identifying starter clutch differences
Before application of Loctite, throughly clean the parts with a good spray on brake cleaner, or Acetone, and let the parts dry before assembly.

1982 GPZ1100 B2
General Dynamics/Convair 1983-1993
GLCM BGM-109 Tomahawk, AGM-129A Advanced Cruise Missile (ACM)

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11 May 2010 11:22 #367239 by OnlyK
Thanks for the help! The link to the redline article was helpful.
Any idea on finding the various thickness dampeners? The parts listings I find only show 1 number 92075-193 7.3T (assuming 7.3mm thick). I also cannot find the part number for the rear washer (behind the gear) on the 1978.

KZ1000-A2 ,KZ1000-B2, 79 KZ1300, 72 H1, 84 GPZ900R and too many KX's to count!

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11 May 2010 16:49 #367309 by keith1
Replied by keith1 on topic Help identifying starter clutch differences
as far as the dampers go, they arent cheap.....i was nt thinking earlier tonite when i sold 2 boxes of parts that i know had 1 or 2 in there....anyway, check with Z-1...i think johnnys vintage still has some......they show on ebay occasionally....same advice for the washer....if you cant find it, let me know....i didnt sell all my stuff..i know i have a rotor and stator left somewhere, and that washer might be with them....

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11 May 2010 20:54 #367356 by gane
Only, In the day, Whenever damage had been done to stator/cover , I liked to remove plug caps, & with cover removed, hit starter motor, & observe rotor for true. this reveals possible crank damage, or damage to rotor. I only mention this because you mention unusual wear at starter sprag wheel bush. If there is a wobble at stator, remove & look to crank nose, same test.. hope there is no need. G

[img][/img] 1977 KZ1000A1

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