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1980 project mikuni rs 34 tuning 25 May 2023 09:01 #885179

  • rich67
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Hello, Everyone , First I want to say thanks to everyone who chimed in , I really appreciate all the helpful advice. I'v been away for a few days so just getting to them . 
Injected : I have only bench syn the carbs , I did vac check they are all even but they have a large bounce even with the orifice installed in tubes . It has been a very long time since I degreed   cams and I lost some notes . I found my cam card for the 410  cams and APE calls out for 107.5 intake and 108.5 exhaust for suggestion . according to APE its a Moderately Tight to moderate  lobe separation reducing idle quality and Idle Vacuum is Reduced  . I had spoken with Larry but can not find the email as to what he suggested . Idle is set to 1500 and bounces to 1700  then back to 1500. I am going to remove the valve cover and recheck . At the time I didnt have a the beat dial indicator so the might be off . 
Dave : thanks for the vid that gives me some insight . That's nicest 1100 I have ever seen very nice work 
What do you guys think about the cam card degree values ?  I suspect they might be off. I will keep you guys posted 

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1980 project mikuni rs 34 tuning 25 May 2023 16:43 #885194

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Hello, Everyone , First I want to say thanks to everyone who chimed in , I really appreciate all the helpful advice. I'v been away for a few days so just getting to them . Injected : I have only bench syn the carbs , I did vac check they are all even but they have a large bounce even with the orifice installed in tubes . It has been a very long time since I degreed   cams and I lost some notes . I found my cam card for the 410  cams and APE calls out for 107.5 intake and 108.5 exhaust for suggestion . according to APE its a Moderately Tight to moderate  lobe separation reducing idle quality and Idle Vacuum is Reduced  . I had spoken with Larry but can not find the email as to what he suggested . Idle is set to 1500 and bounces to 1700  then back to 1500. I am going to remove the valve cover and recheck . At the time I didnt have a the beat dial indicator so the might be off . Dave : thanks for the vid that gives me some insight . That's nicest 1100 I have ever seen very nice work What do you guys think about the cam card degree values ?  I suspect they might be off. I will keep you guys posted  
Here is what I found for a timing card from the APE site :

www.aperaceparts.com/tech/camsk410.html



I think Larry would have suggested 108-110LC, making the most of his port job - It would run more like a race motor.
If your down towards the 105-106 settings they tend to run like a tractor, I don't think that's what your after just by looking at what else you got going on with the rest of your bike.

There is not a lot of duration in those cams so the vacuum loss is minimal. They are a hot street cam meant for street riding, they are a good cam for a mildly hopped up engine.

If your going to have the cam cover off check and record the valve lash before removing the cams just to make sure your still at .006" lash.

You have to remember that your engine is no longer stock, it will be a little rough at idle, you have increased all the aspects of your engine (bore, port/valve size, carb size, cam lift)
You have only so many adjustments you can make to optimize your tuning on this type of engine (carbureted air cooled)

Here is a video of my 650 street bike idling with big valve head and 280 duration cams set at 108LC.


 
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1980 project mikuni rs 34 tuning 25 May 2023 18:15 #885199

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Injected : I totally agree with what you saying , Problem is I dont remember what I set them to because its been 10 years ago . I built it for a hot street bike and have built many motors with mods so I Know its not going to run like a stocker , I wanted to check valve clearance so I figured While Im in there might as well see what I have them set to I agree I think LC sugested 108-110 but I dont know were I set them to , I also have a small cover leak and it would be a good time to replace . MAN I CANT BELIEVE THE COST OF A KZ COVER GASKET FROM KAWASAKI , PRICES ARE RIDICULOUS partszilla wants 152.00 shipped 

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1980 project mikuni rs 34 tuning 25 May 2023 18:28 #885202

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10 years is a long time to think back. I am in the habit of writing all my tuning info down because I know I will want to know 3-4 years down the line.

I am currently building a KZ1000 street engine just about a mirror image of yours.

1197 MTC 10.5:1, 37/31 KZ head ported to about 95CFM, .418" lift WebCam 280 duration cams (shim under), VM33 Smooth bore carbs.

I use a Color Tune to set my pilots then plug chops to set mains.

I make as many gaskets as I can from a master set from bulk roll Fel-Pro paper.

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1980 project mikuni rs 34 tuning 25 May 2023 20:11 #885205

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Here is the cam card i received when i bought the cams from APE , I agree keeping notes is essential I keep all mine in a file with all my invoices it a big help to remember 10 years later  .
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1980 project mikuni rs 34 tuning 26 May 2023 00:50 #885209

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LC (lobe centres) is a term I'm not familiar with here in the UK. Am I right in assuming this is a timing figure for "full lift" (centre of the dwell on the tip of the lobe) ??
I am a little confused by the "cam card" data! if the inlet opens at 18.5 BTDC and closes at 53.5 ABDC then the mid point would be 126 degrees ATDC but the LC figure is 107.5 degrees.
Is this the start of the "dwell" at full lift or is the profile asymmetric ??
Would like to understand better (I have dialled in "Piper" cams in cars previously but the timing data for these is quoted at the centre of the dwell so involves additional measurements to establish "start" and "end" of dwell and then establish the mid-point)

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1980 project mikuni rs 34 tuning 26 May 2023 05:01 #885211

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LC (lobe centres) is a term I'm not familiar with here in the UK. Am I right in assuming this is a timing figure for "full lift" (centre of the dwell on the tip of the lobe) ??
I am a little confused by the "cam card" data! if the inlet opens at 18.5 BTDC and closes at 53.5 ABDC then the mid point would be 126 degrees ATDC but the LC figure is 107.5 degrees.
Is this the start of the "dwell" at full lift or is the profile asymmetric ??
Would like to understand better (I have dialled in "Piper" cams in cars previously but the timing data for these is quoted at the centre of the dwell so involves additional measurements to establish "start" and "end" of dwell and then establish the mid-point)
 
This should explain the lobe centers :

store.schnitzracing.com/cam-lobe-centers-explained/

There is a calculation involved, need to put that school math to practice :)

Its probably on here in the archives somewhere, just easier to Google it.
 
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1980 project mikuni rs 34 tuning 26 May 2023 05:12 #885212

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Here is the cam card i received when i bought the cams from APE , I agree keeping notes is essential I keep all mine in a file with all my invoices it a big help to remember 10 years later  .
 

I have never seen a timing card with 1/2 degree increments on it, all of the ones I have been issued are to the nearest degree.

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1980 project mikuni rs 34 tuning 25 Jun 2023 21:00 #886421

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Just a little update I finally got around to checking the cam Degree i had sent and found they were way out , Intake was set to 109 deg and the exh was at 105 . Way out of spec, I think my deg Wheel was not at the correct TDC when I degreed the cam  . I also found the exhaust cam has been hitting the valve cover . When I had sent the head to Larry he clearance the valve cover on the intake side by removing the X casting on the intake side . what i found was the cover also needs to be clearance on the exhaust side as well if head has the exhaust gas recirculation ports on the #2 and #3 exhaust cam . I will include a pic . Thanks 
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1980 project mikuni rs 34 tuning 01 Aug 2023 05:04 #887769

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Hi Rich67 - have tried emailing you ref a BOTM feature on this stunning KZ1000 but I am getting a bounce back saying there is an issue with your mailbox ?

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1980 project mikuni rs 34 tuning 14 Sep 2023 03:20 #889364

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Hi Rich67 - have tried emailing you ref a BOTM feature on this stunning KZ1000 but I am getting a bounce back saying there is an issue with your mailbox ?
Hi  Rich, can you please confirm if there is an issue with your email ?

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1980 project mikuni rs 34 tuning 15 Sep 2023 00:02 #889391

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For some reason my PM's  are not showing ? 

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