Replace cam chain or not?

Jeff,
I ordered the chain and master links early this morning. I decided not to risk putting the bike back together without the chain. Hopefully, I can figure out a way to stake the link with the engine still in the frame.

Thanks

Post edited by: fishbone1, at: 2006/09/11 04:15

I'll put my last comment in. I'll stick by my original comment that a camchain will last 100k miles. This is purely on my own experience and that of several friends that have ridden many miles on these bikes. Sure Jeff saw a engine break a chain at 40k, but how often does this happen? Once in 40,000 engines? That means we all need to now change our perfectly good chain because of one failure. I knew a guy with a Honda CBX that had 2k miles on it, was idling happily and the camchain broke. I guess now all CBX riders should adopt that mileage as the mileage to replace their chains. I don't think so, just ride and leave them alone. My Honda story is not made up either, I really did see this happen. Another thing to consider is "a lot" of aftermarket stuff is utter trash. I don't know what chains Jeff sells, they are probably OK, but many times you might replace a perfectly good factory part with a piece of garbage that breaks in 30 days.

RonKZ650,
I am just replacing the cam chain to be safe since I had some bent valves and the previous owner had no idea how it happened. I probably don't need the cam chain but I don't want to take the chance. I can measure valve cleance, cylinder bore, ring gap, but I have no way to check the cam chain.?????

Ron, I'm going to be blunt - anyone listening to your advice is a fool. You are giving misleading and wrong information. If you poll the vast majority of people who have rebuilt engines, you will get the same answer - 30,000-40,000 miles is the typical end of life on a cam chain. 100,000 mile is pure folly.

Yes you can push beyond that. But it is foolhardly to rebuild an engine and NOT replace the cam chain.

Additionally NONE of the aftermarket cam chains are junk. In fact, ALL of them are the same quality or BETTER than what was put in the engine originally. If you buy parts in a Kawasaki bag, they are either DID, EK or one of the other chain manufacturers - just priced higher.

I'm not sure about your bike, but the manual for my 1000 specifies a certain length over a specific number of links. If it's too long, the chain needs replaced. If everyone agrees that it's OK to use the master link type cam chain, and you don't need to tear apart the bottom end, I would definitely change the chain. I have been leary about using the masterlink type, but don't want to tear down the bottom end right now.

Jeff- do you feel comfortable with the master link type chains even on built engines? Mine will be a 1260 with .425 cams and O/S SS valves, mild porting (79 MKII). Maybe I should change mine too?? Mileage is low (17,000), but many of those have come a quarter mile at a time
Thanks

79MKII,

I will be putting the 750 back together starting tomorrow. My cam chain arrived from Z1enterprises today(very quick service). I received my valve spring compressor and complete gasket kit a couple of days ago. Hopefully, I won't run into any problems. We will see how the master linked chain works out.

I would not use a split cam chain on a performance motor - the stress on the cam chain increases when you go with the combination of heavy-duty valve springs and high-lift cams. These are the things that put the most stress on the chains,

Jeff.Saunders wrote:

I would not use a split cam chain on a performance motor - the stress on the cam chain increases when you go with the combination of heavy-duty valve springs and high-lift cams. These are the things that put the most stress on the chains,

Thanks Jeff. I was thinking the same thing. I plan on measuring the length as specified in my manual and take it from there.

how about a picture of those leftover pistons 79MKII ? i came across a couple extra motors when i was at my dads last week ,im not a fan of stock rebuilds if im gonna tear an engine all the way down its gonna something worth my time when its done.on a mild rebuild i see no problem with the masterlinked chain ive seen people use them on higher end motors but i dont reccomend it myself if you are going to all the trouble to split the cases to weld crank id throw a one piece chain in there while its apart.

I have always thought that measuring a cam chain as specified in the Kaw service manual made little sense. If you have the chain out of the engine to measure the distance between the specificed number of links or at least have the entire top end off, why not just go ahead and replace the chain? Would you put it back if it is only worn half as much as the max? Even if not worn out of spec, it will have some wear...

As far as Jeff's contention that master link chains are somehow not as strong as endless chains, well, I am not real sure I agree with that either. If you look closely at any endless chain, the pins are all peened or staked or whatever you call the process by a machine. When you put a master link on, the master link is the same exact dimensions as the other chain links. The ends get staked/peened and if you stake/peen them as well as the originals, there should be NO difference in that link's strength. In addition, the stress on the chain is in its length and not side pressure so if you were to JERK a master link chain, I think it would be as strong as an endless chain as there is no functional difference in the component parts. There is NO stress on the staking/peening, only in the master link plate and fixed plate; both on the sides. I don't do racing or build high performance motors so this is all conjecture on my part and if any of our go-fast types have first hand experience with chain failures because of a loss of a master link, I would be interested in hearing about it.

wireman wrote:

how about a picture of those leftover pistons 79MKII ? i came across a couple extra motors when i was at my dads last week ,im not a fan of stock rebuilds if im gonna tear an engine all the way down its gonna something worth my time when its done.on a mild rebuild i see no problem with the masterlinked chain ive seen people use them on higher end motors but i dont reccomend it myself if you are going to all the trouble to split the cases to weld crank id throw a one piece chain in there while its apart.

Check your PM

Jeff.Saunders wrote:

If you poll the vast majority of people who have rebuilt engines, you will get the same answer - 30,000-40,000 miles is the typical end of life on a cam chain.Yes you can push beyond that. But it is foolhardly to rebuild an engine and NOT replace the cam chain.

So are you also saying that normal life for a KZ motor is 30-40K before it needs a rebuild? :ohmy: It seems like every time I get pumped up about getting my 1100 running, I see a post like this and it starts to make me wonder if it's even worth it. To me 40K is a years riding and I don't want something I'm gonna have to re-build every year. The bike already has 20K on it so If what I'm reading is the "Norm" then I can get maybe 6 months riding out of it before it's junk. I'm starting to think (AGAIN) that maybe I just need to get this one running good, sell it to someone who doesn't ride much and apply the $$ to get something else that will last longer. Signed, Depressed again

Post edited by: Mikes82KZ1100, at: 2006/09/14 14:27