Clutch or clutch cable problem ?

Hello, seems I need some help/advice as I either is totally stupid or doing something wrong. 
First, english is not my mother language so there may be some wrong names on some parts.  What ever I do I cant get the clutch working on my project bike a  rebuilt KZ400ltd (Pictures in the project thread). 
As the original clutch cable was broken I bought a new one on ebay, OEM according to the seller. Though, the new one is a bit shorter but the "nipple ends" (Cabel outside the cable cover) seems to be the same. I attached some pictures to support my problems...
When installing the cable I did like this:'
1. Make sure the release arm is in right position and attache the wire.
2. Mount the cover
3. Adjust the screw that press the rod until I get some pressure on the rod.
4. Mount the wire on the clutch handle.
5. Adjust the screws on the cable and the handle.

Result:  With max adjustment on the cable and up at the handle the clutch don´t "kick in" when pressing the handle. When adjust for some more pressure with the screw for the rod at max adjusted, I can feel that the clutch give only a small amount of effect when pressing the handle. 

-Could the cable end (outside the cover) be to long?
-Did I something wrong with the install or adjustment?
-Can there be any faults with the clutch itself? (Have checked the rod, and it looks fine I think)

Would be happy for some advice on this problem...


 

Remove and disassemble the clutch release mechanism and look for broken or missing parts.

Thx, 
I have cleaned and greased it and it looked fine, but will check it again, this time with magnifying glass... 
 

What direction did you turn the clutch release adjusting screw?
Some models are clockwise first. But my 81 KZ650-CSR is counter-clockwise first;
Yours could be the same as mine:  counter-clockwise first until hard to turn, then clockwise 1/4 turn. 
 

Did you route your new clutch cable exactly how the original cable was routed?

There should be a ball bearing on the end of the clutch rod that pushes on the actuator which engages the clutch plates (items 24/25 in picture)

Sometimes this gets stuck to the end of the rod, you take out the rod and it falls on the floor. If missing your going to be about 5 mm short and never engage the pusher.



You have to figure out a way of measuring the total assembly length to see if its in the engine. If you have a lot of clearance to the end of the rod where it goes into the cover actuator (your 3rd picture) then its probably missing. That way you don't need to take the clutch apart.

Those ball bearings are inch size I believe, slightly less diameter than the rod OD so they are easy to replace.


 

wrote:

What direction did you turn the clutch release adjusting screw?
Some models are clockwise first. But my 81 KZ650-CSR is counter-clockwise first;
Yours could be the same as mine:  counter-clockwise first until hard to turn, then clockwise 1/4 turn. 

 

Mine as well is counter-clockwise and I did the adjustment like you did.

wrote:

There should be a ball bearing on the end of the clutch rod that pushes on the actuator which engages the clutch plates (items 24/25 in picture)

Sometimes this gets stuck to the end of the rod, you take out the rod and it falls on the floor. If missing your going to be about 5 mm short and never engage the pusher.

You have to figure out a way of measuring the total assembly length to see if its in the engine. If you have a lot of clearance to the end of the rod where it goes into the cover actuator (your 3rd picture) then its probably missing. That way you don't need to take the clutch apart.

Those ball bearings are inch size I believe, slightly less diameter than the rod OD so they are easy to replace.





 

Ok thx and very interesting...
 If its lost.. do you think the rod could be close enough to affect the pusher a "little" bit..?
Reason for asking is that if I adjust the cabel adjusters and the "rod" adjuster at max I get enough pressaure on the clutch  so I could with first gear in, turn the wheel with my hand though its still not even near of "free" spinning. With other words, it feels like if i could press the clutch handle a few centimeters more it would work. 
And when I think of it, When I adjust the screw for the rod it dont pressure the rod until maybe a half or 3/4 turn. So missing bearing ball could  be the reason ???
This I have to check coming weekend...

 

wrote:

Did you route your new clutch cable exactly how the original cable was routed?

Yes I did....

 

By Perra: Mine as well is counter-clockwise and I did the adjustment like you did.

Okay. Then I would try clockwise first until hard to turn, then counterclockwise 1/4 or 1/2 turn, which is the way it's done on models w the type of slotted screw in the diagram posted by Injected. 

note: the models that are counterclockwise first have a different slotted screw >> there's a collar or flange welded to the midpoint of the screw. #22 in the diagram in the link here:  www.partzilla.com/catalog/kawasaki/motor...1979/kz400-h1/clutch

So, have done and tested all advise and suggestions you have giving me. Thx for that.
However, nothing helped. Still only get the clutch activated just a tiny bit and its not enough.
Was googling and found this video on youtube.  
The guy seems to have the same problems and my bike. So decided to remove the "clutch" cover to check the disk and oil them...easy peasy....not..
Opened up the cover to timing unit and found a bolt looking as the picture. A carefully tried to unscrew it  without and with some heat, but stoped as it seems tightend as hell and I probably would make it even worse.
Any suggestions how to remove it?

 

Perra post=876037

wrote:

There should be a ball bearing on the end of the clutch rod that pushes on the actuator which engages the clutch plates (items 24/25 in picture)

Sometimes this gets stuck to the end of the rod, you take out the rod and it falls on the floor. If missing your going to be about 5 mm short and never engage the pusher.

You have to figure out a way of measuring the total assembly length to see if its in the engine. If you have a lot of clearance to the end of the rod where it goes into the cover actuator (your 3rd picture) then its probably missing. That way you don't need to take the clutch apart.

Those ball bearings are inch size I believe, slightly less diameter than the rod OD so they are easy to replace.








 

Ok thx and very interesting...
 If its lost.. do you think the rod could be close enough to affect the pusher a "little" bit..?
Reason for asking is that if I adjust the cabel adjusters and the "rod" adjuster at max I get enough pressaure on the clutch  so I could with first gear in, turn the wheel with my hand though its still not even near of "free" spinning. With other words, it feels like if i could press the clutch handle a few centimeters more it would work. 
And when I think of it, When I adjust the screw for the rod it dont pressure the rod until maybe a half or 3/4 turn. So missing bearing ball could  be the reason ???
This I have to check coming weekend...



 

Sorry for the late reply, just saw this.

To answer your question, No it won't reach.
The ball bearing is probably 1/4" (don't know that model) as most push rods I know are 7 mm. The ball goes right thru the transmission shaft across the motor to the pusher, so if its missing you would not be able to reach it, as I believe the working stroke on the clutch is usually only about .10-.12" (1/8") I believe there is only enough adjustment for slight wear of the clutch plates. The whole system is designed to be setup in middle range of adjustment with all the parts "present", so having the cable at max is not the correct thing to do.

If you put a ball in there and one is already there you would not be able to put the clutch cover on all the way (gap all the way around on the bolts) you could easily glue/tape a ball bearing on the end of the rod and push it thru to test. Other safer way is to measure the stack up length as I already mentioned.