rehoning

If in doubt boar it out

OMR, don't you dare agree with me! That would take out all the fun of posting here. :woohoo:

All Cylinders Don't Need Honing

This turned out not to work well in the case of rebores. First of all, there has been no threading effect of the boring bar, but rather the smooth even surface of a well-worn-in cylinder wall brought to a mirror-like finish by previous running. In fact, they found it to be as detrimental in these cases to touch that beautifully-finished cylinder with a hone as it was not to in the cases of fresh rebores!

This is not theory here. It is the conclusion of an intensive research project, involving re-ringing used bores in like engines, some being honed, or "de-glazed," as the Old Wives like to call it, and the others just having the rings replaced and the cylinders left alone. The results were the same in every case - after being run for a period of time, - the equivalent of thousands of miles of use - the honed engines IN EVERY CASE burned more oil, and upon disassembly and inspection, IN EVERY CASE had developed significantly greater clearances - piston, ring end gap, all bearings, the works - than the unhoned engines. Although not expected by many to do so, the unhoned engines in ALL cases and at ALL STAGES burned less oil, and had worn significantly less than their honed counterparts. That is the result of the research. Now for the explanation.

The Explanation + more

Lots of articles on cylinder glaze found by Google, and of course they don't agree with each other.


My point being, you already have a good seal on three cylinders with around 10 hours running time. Why would you want to mess up the cylinder walls and make the rings start wearing it smooth all over again? Might not be so lucky this time on getting a good ring seal.

If it ain't broke, don't mess with it.

Other side of the logic.....

Already had a bad ring, has some scaring in the cylinder. AS from what I can tell doesn't sound as the cylinders were not honed/de-glazed in the (500 miles previously). Granted WTF do I know.

At least ball honing for cross hatch pattern will remove most/all burring that may be present in the cylinder from the damaged ring. At which point, if you do one, you might as well do all...

You're only running a few up and down runs through the cylinder with either the 3 arm bar hone or ball hone... That process when accomplished correctly isn't going to take off any measureable(with most tools) amount of cylinder metal. Them sonsabitches walls are hard and it takes a hell of a lot more than that to wear them puppies open.

As for pros/cons, yeah I've done some research previously, most of the articles are regarding cast iron rings, old British bike metals, re-plating nickel composite cylinders, non ferrous etc...

Me, hell after having to go back in any ways for the ring, ball hone them cylinders.

I'd be so pissed at myself that after putting it all back together with a new head gasket @ $50 find I have lower compression, some oil bypassing the rings into the combustion chamber, the engine smoking out the exhaust and have to go back in... once again... shit this is a no brainer...

Link to Cameron's book, review chapters 11 & 12....

Kevin Cameron's book on 4 strokes....

Ball honing? Ouch!!

all four bores look smooth as glass..no burrs that i can detect with a finger nail...

and just to put it out there..no cross hatch visible...just mirror smooth finish..so...to leave it alone or not is the question...really be pissed to have to pull it apart again..counting on you learned gentlemen...

at 500 miles on the motor id lightly run a hone down all four just enough to break up the shine not more than one or two seconds with a drill. dont take much. every single time i pull down a motor i do this and replace rings. you can re use the remaining rings if they pass visual inspection but check the gap again cause you can. i choose to re ring every teardown because it brings back the compression as long as your valves are properly adjusted. at 500 miles id not worry with replacing anything additional. im on my 15th or so build on a bike motor and ive built more car motors than i can count. all still run strong other than a handfull that suffered catastrophic failure due to nitrous or mechanical failures pushing under rated parts. never had to take apart one to do a re do other than a honda that wouldnt seal a headgasket due to machine shop dicking up a head, and a chevy 355 that had the wrong push rods. other than that all have stared, ran thru break in oil and ripped and tore shit up in a good way. just my opinion.

lushbaugh wrote: at 500 miles on the motor id lightly run a hone down all four just enough to break up the shine not more than one or two seconds with a drill. dont take much. every single time i pull down a motor i do this and replace rings. you can re use the remaining rings if they pass visual inspection but check the gap again cause you can. i choose to re ring every teardown because it brings back the compression as long as your valves are properly adjusted. at 500 miles id not worry with replacing anything additional. im on my 15th or so build on a bike motor and ive built more car motors than i can count. all still run strong other than a handfull that suffered catastrophic failure due to nitrous or mechanical failures pushing under rated parts. never had to take apart one to do a re do other than a honda that wouldnt seal a headgasket due to machine shop dicking up a head, and a chevy 355 that had the wrong push rods. other than that all have stared, ran thru break in oil and ripped and tore shit up in a good way. just my opinion.

How in the world did you get wrong pushrods in a sb chevy?
Did somebody try running non hardened pushrods with guide plates? :sick: :woohoo:

Most of the people on here have never worked in a dealership service department. That said, they also haven't seen how things get done by a lot of mechanics.

I will tell you that I've seen lots of blocks pulled back when we warrantied J model crankshafts. Those blocks got put right back on the same pistons and rings with no hone job. None of them smoked afterward.

Mind you, they also didn't smoke before they were torn down either....

long story short guy drops off a box of junk thats miss matched and says here build it. ill give you a guess as to why the push rod was too short.... hint, aftermarket rockers...

now if someone really really wants me to do any kind of work i work with them to figure out what they need and i order it. i just say hey you dont take steaks and potatos to a resturant and ask them to cook it for you so dont bring your half finished crap to me lol

LarryC wrote: they also didn't smoke before they were torn down either....

thats the part thats key. his ring bent. i do it for insurance.there was no other reason for teardown for the j motors other than the recall so id do the same thing, swap out the crank and re assemble. i know you know your stuff just saying what i prefer and why. ultimately there will be a hundred guys on the internet telling someone how to do something when they never did it but theres alot of guys on here that have thank god :woohoo:

honestly the best advice you can get on this matter is dont take any advice from dnthavakawman :whistle: :laugh: