what PHONY 'HOTTER CAMS' look like!

It is actually better for the motor if the clearance is a little larger than too small. If the clearance is too small, the valve can stay a little open, and you can burn it, or worse yet, bend it. If the gap is a LITTLE bigger, it will just make a little more noise. If it is way too big, you can spit a shim. If the gap is also to small (or non existent) things also have a tendency to ware much faster. I would also not be surprised if everything on that bike was totally stock. I would be willing to make a wager that not only was that bike not bored to a 1135 but not bored at all. It is also not that hard to measure the lift of the cams while they are mounted in the bike. There is plenty of room. I would also be willing to bet that you will find the lift to be .295 on the exhaust and .315 on the intake. Those cams are stock. The easy way to tell is if you look at the center section and there is an "L" on one side of center and an "R" on the other, and the metal on the lobe peaks is homogeneous.

OHHH SHOOTSKIES.

I have just now completed reading my valve clearances. The thinnest leaf on my feeler gauge is .05mm.

ONLY HALF OF THE 8 VALVES on my 1978 kz1000-A2 passed muster.

Half of the valves do not even show .05mm or more clearance.


So how do I know what thickness of shim to buy for the valves whose clearance is below .05mm, and how do you remove the shims? I don't have the special 'shim removing tool' shown in the FSM. And since I have no intention of buying one as I will never use it but once -- how does everyone proceed here?

OR, WITH 28.5K MILES -- DOES IT NEED A VALVE JOB?

That is very simple. In your manual there is a chart. Once you have measured the clearances. Mark them somewhere so you do not forget. than you may remove the shims that are too small or too big. You may be able to use some shims that you have removed in other spots that need that particular size. The size is etched in the back of each shim. If you cant read it just Mic. it. Make sure that you put the side with the SIZE etched in it to the LIFTER side not to the lobe side. There is a chart in your KSM that will tell you exactly which size you will require according to the gap and shim size which was just in there. You would want to be closer to the .1 than to the .05 gap. You will have to get yourself a set go gauges that go down to .01mm

otakar wrote:

That is very simple. In your manual there is a chart. Once you have measured the clearances. Mark them somewhere so you do not forget. than you may remove the shims that are too small or too big. You may be able to use some shims that you have removed in other spots that need that particular size. The size is etched in the back of each shim. If you cant read it just Mic. it. Make sure that you put the side with the SIZE etched in it to the LIFTER side not to the lobe side. There is a chart in your KSM that will tell you exactly which size you will require according to the gap and shim size which was just in there. You would want to be closer to the .1 than to the .05 gap. You will have to get yourself a set go gauges that go down to .01mm

I found that chart after posting, and thanks.


How do you like to remove the shims without the special Kaw tool?

newOld_kz1000 wrote:

...Half of the valves do not even show .05mm or more clearance. So how do I know what thickness of shim to buy for the valves whose clearance is below .05mm, and how do you remove the shims? I don't have the special 'shim removing tool' shown in the FSM. And since I have no intention of buying one as I will never use it but once -- how does everyone proceed here? OR, WITH 28.5K MILES -- DOES IT NEED A VALVE JOB?

Checking valve clearances is routine maintenance based on mileage intervals.

I use the inexpensive MotionPro tool from Z1E. But use only the batwing piece and toss the lever.

Click here > www.z1enterprises.com/detail.aspx?ID=152

As already advised, must know size of existing shim to determine next thinner size. There's a shim table in the FSM. The shims don't wear out, and sometimes a thinner shim from another valve works where the other valve requires a yet thinner shim.

Unlikely that a valve job is needed, especially with acceptable cold compression numbers, and relatively low mileage. First step is to adjust clearances. If compression remains low after valve clearance adjustments, would suggest leak down test to help identify where compression is escaping.

Imo, a valve adjustment tool is essential toward proper care and maintenance of these old large fours.

Good Luck!

Remember Chevy Chase in "Vacation" just before he jumps into the motel swimming pool with Christy Brinkley? He claps his hands in front of himself and repeatedly says

"This is crazy! This is Crazy! This is Crazy! This is Crazy!"

This IS crazy. I can't find a *true metric* feeler gauge set locally (checked Napa Auto, Kragen, Harbor Freight) or online for that matter.


Smallest metric leaf on any gauge I found today is .038mm.

I need a gauge that goes down to, say, .01mm so that I can astutely assess the clearance shortcomings of the valve shims on my 'free' 1978 kz1000-A2.

Anyone buy a feeler gauge that goes down to .01mm for valve adjustment and if so, where?

IDEALLY -- I'd like to find a feeler gauge that is *true metric*, ie. in increments of .01mm as in:

.01mm
.02mm
.03mm
.04mm

etc. All the feeler gauges out there seem to be incremented in English increments, as in:
.019in
.020in
.021in

Heck, *surely* them fellers know we are riding sophisticated metric machines made mostly for Americans.

Where can I find a feeler gauge that has at *least* a .01mm leaf on it?

Patton wrote:

Checking valve clearances is routine maintenance based on mileage intervals.

I use the inexpensive MotionPro tool from Z1E. But use only the batwing piece and toss the lever.

Click here > www.z1enterprises.com/detail.aspx?ID=152

I am there man, I am THERE! I already ordered some parts from Z1 this past Friday so I'm calling them tomorrow (Monday) to add this audaciously cheap yet highly beneficial valve shim removal tool to my order!

THANKS!

You don't need metric feeler guages. Although most feeler guages these days are stamped with both SAE and Metric values.

1mm = .03937"

mm to inches calculation formula

.05 * .03937 = .0019" [.002 rounded up]
.10 * .03937 = .0039" [.004 rounded up]
.15 * .03937 = .0059" [.006 rounded up]

You need feeler guages in the range of .0015" to .010" to do lash adjustment / check on KZ 900 / 1000 motors.

Why do people always make checking lash on these motors such a big deal? It's really very simple.

The set that I have are etched both metric and inch. I do not know where I got mine but they say made in China. Mine start at .04mm and go to .10 in .01 increments than up to .20 they are in .02 increments after .20 they are in .05 increments up to 1.0mm

larrycavan wrote:

You don't need metric feeler guages. Although most feeler guages these days are stamped with both SAE and Metric values.

1mm = .03937"

mm to inches calculation formula

.05 * .03937 = .0019" [.002 rounded up]
.10 * .03937 = .0039" [.004 rounded up]
.15 * .03937 = .0059" [.006 rounded up]

You need feeler guages in the range of .0015" to .010" to do lash adjustment / check on KZ 900 / 1000 motors.

Your first calculation, which multiplies .03937 inches by .05mm, assumes that you intend to check for an in-spec clearance, which implies that the smallest gap you intend to measure when you check valve lash is .05mm

That's fine, because the FSM calls for a range of .05mm to .10mm clearance between the shim and the cam lobe.

The first 2 calculations test the low boundary (.05mm) and the high boundary (.10mm) of being in-spec as per the manual.

The 3rd calculation will test an "out-of-spec" gap of .15mm

In other words, using the feeler gauge leafs from the calculations above, you can check both min and max gap allowable, plus you can check for a substantially out-of-spec and too-large gap of .15mm

What I want to do is....since 1/2 my valves are showing gaps below the minimum boundary of the allowable range, ie. 4 of my valves have less than .05mm gap -- I want to answer the question:

"How much clearance is there, given that the gap on 4 of my 8 valves is *less than* .05mm?"

This may sound anal, but I want to find out, worst case, if in fact I have *no gap at all* on some of these valves.

Also, Knowing what the current gap is will help me choose a starting point for how much smaller a shim I'm going to need.

I'm suspicious that I have no gap at all on some of these 4 valves, and according to the chart if I'm already at a 2mm shim on a valve with 0 clearance, I'm screwed.

The FSM says 'If the smallest shim does not sufficiently increase clearance, replace the valve seat, then grind down the valve stem' -- I'm not a machinist and I don't want to do a valve job on this bike.

One question, as you sound experienced, you mention that the .0015" feeler gauge, which is about .04mm will come in handy, what would you do in my case if my shims are already on the thinnest setting?

What gets me is my compression tests at 140psi per bore seem *really* good for a valve or two to not be fully seating. That part I don't quite get yet.

I *could* have been clearer about just WHY I want to check for a clearance of .01mm to .04mm. So here goes.

If I could establish that I have at LEAST a .01mm gap with the existing shim, that is the most efficient shim replacement process that is possible because -- since the shims are in .05mm increments -- a gap of between .01mm to .04mm means I know exactly which shim I need to buy -- just one shim smaller than the one I have.

The reason I know this: if, say, the current gap is .01mm, I know that going exactly one shim smaller will increase the gap to .06mm (.01mm + .05mm) which is in spec.

Otherwise, it's going to be a guessing game/trial and error if I can't measure. I'll have to wait until the shim removal tool gets delivered, probably 1 week away, and remove the current shim then purchase the next 2 smaller shim sizes and mess around with it.

The best thing that could happen for me is that I discover that my 4 out-of-spec valves have a gap of at least between .01 to .04mm -- because I could then order the correct shims tomorrow at the same time I order the shim replacement tool.

Don't get the cheap tool go for the more expensive one. It costs more but will save you a lot of time when you use it. Don't think you will use it only once, you should check your valves at least once a year.