COMPRESSION TEST ADVICE AND SPARK PLUGS TOO

The #2 and the #3 plugs despite the poor photos are very good, a light tan colored electrode.

The #4 plug was too rich due to a stuck-open choke plunger which I fixed by lubing the plunger shaft on the #4 carb.

The #1 plug is puzzling, I'm looking for an air leak as soon as there's no rain with WD40.

I will check the voltage at the coils.

But you know, that is just a 'static' test, measuring the voltage at the coil.

What I would LIKE to do is a *dynamic* test of the spark.

I'd like to have some way to measure the voltage spike and the duration *delivered to the spark plug* --

ANYONE KNOW HOW TO DO THAT?

I don't think measuring the voltage at the coil will be reliable -- it's better to know what's actually being delivered down the wire to the plug to be 100% sure that the spark is actually healthy.

Are you even sure the motor is hopped up? It sure doesnt sound right to do all that and leave out a critical component like the carbs.

Kawickrice wrote:

Are you even sure the motor is hopped up? It sure doesnt sound right to do all that and leave out a critical component like the carbs.

I know, I know. But the prior owner was honest.

NO I have no idea why he didn't do the carbs!
No idea.

But let me speculate here!!

He gave me this bike. And it became a solid runner
with just a little bit of work. He was an old gentleman who lives in a very nice upscale area, I met his family, all very nice people, nope he was not b.s.-ing me. Had no reason to. Older people (he's in his mid-80s, he must have been in his mid-late 50s when he bought the bike new in 1978) tend to 'settle down' and I have no doubt he gave me the straight scoop.

He owned it for awhile and I suspect someone talked him into the mods, or he got some crazy itch to renew the bike after he got used to it, and had the work done. It's easy to imagine him getting someone to do the engine mods who either was incompetent about carbs, and/or he for whatever reason didn't take any advice he might have gotten to address the carbs issue.

But if you think about it -- how many guys have you run into where, when you notice "Hey there, so you put some K&N pods on your carbs and some hotter pipes. What size mains and pilots did you have to put in?"

How many times have you run into an acquaintance who, when asked about jetting questions like this, just get this funny look and say, "Huh? What pilot?", or they just tell you "I didn't change the carbs."

In my experience it's been at least 80%. Maybe 90%. My riding buddies are knowledgeable, but it's real *easy* to buy pods and a pipe and throw them on there, "Hey the bike's louder, must be more powerful." Most guys want a cheap trick and don't even dare think about carbs work. Spending money and putting on a pipe is nothing compared to the analytical ability you need to assess and experiment with proper re-jetting. It's a learning curve and a hassle very few riders will take on.

IT'S A COMMON MISTAKE. When you then add in that my prior owner was in his 60s when he had the work done -- it's easy to see him neglecting the carbs.

Shocking in terms of the irregularity of the modifications effort, but easy to imagine due to age and lack of knowledge.

He didn't neglect the carbs. His friend liked the new set he had on there so much he sold them to him, and put the origional ones back on the bike. :laugh:

Anywho: Don't matter now.

Cheap way: Pods + Re-Jet.

Expensive(best)way: New carbs + Pods + Re-jet.

Cheers!

Oh yeah... twist harder! :laugh:
and pods rock... great power adder, if you know jetting.

Good Luck!

TeK9iNe wrote:

He didn't neglect the carbs. His friend liked the new set he had on there so much he sold them to him, and put the origional ones back on the bike. :laugh:

Anywho: Don't matter now.

Cheap way: Pods + Re-Jet.

Expensive(best)way: New carbs + Pods + Re-jet.

Cheers!

Oh yeah... twist harder! :laugh:
and pods rock... great power adder, if you know jetting.

Good Luck!

You may well be right on that one.
Thanks for the pods advice -- may well be the cheapest way to take advantage of the motor mods without buying a new bank of carbs.

newOld_kz1000 wrote:

Thanks for the pods advice -- may well be the cheapest way to take advantage of the motor mods without buying a new bank of carbs.

You're darn right! :lol:

Thing is, when you buy pods, you need to buy a whole bunch of jets. There's just so many factors in the power equation. You can usually get some good info on where to start with jetting, but often the correct jets (most power) are completely different.

Patience, and long hot days are a requirment. :laugh:

Often people will get a jetting suggestion for pods, throw them on there and tada, poor performance. Its all in the jetting... give it time, and jets!

Cheers.

If not already done, would assure that service float bowl fuel level is correct, by using the clear tube method.

Good Luck!

i wonder if he didnt just throw stock carbs back on there to sell the bike? if youre planning on keeping this bike on the street the majority of the time id say 28-29 carbs are more than up to the challenge ,back when these bikes ruled the streets and tracks there were plenty of 1170-1197 motors running consistant 10 sec quarters with 29 smoothbores,many of them still do.also what cams are in this ?

PLUMMEN wrote:

i wonder if he didnt just throw stock carbs back on there to sell the bike? if youre planning on keeping this bike on the street the majority of the time id say 28-29 carbs are more than up to the challenge ,back when these bikes ruled the streets and tracks there were plenty of 1170-1197 motors running consistant 10 sec quarters with 29 smoothbores,many of them still do.also what cams are in this ?

I haven't popped the valve cover yet, that will come in the next day or so if we get clear weather. Need to check the valves. So I don't know if it's a Webber or what, but will find out soon enough.

I just haven't had this bike very long and spent the past couple months very slowly bringing it back from a 10-12 year backyard porch. Sat so long both brakes froze, carbs were awful dirty (took 2 cleanings cuz I be some kind of idjit apparently, not on purpose though which is good).

He didn't do any kind of "tricky-moh-doo-snappy" with them carbs, leastways I don't think so, as he is OLD. He gave me a 6 volt battery bout the size of a Sony Walkman (not much bigger than a deck of cards) and I said "You know this is a 12 volt bike, are you *sure* this is the battery from 10 year back? I need to buy a new one and I just wanna make sure this is the same model I'll need to buy." and he said "Sonny I do not quite recall but I believe so." Said the 85-year-old frail man.

He does NOT come across as a shim-sham-flibbity-flee type of individual, and because of that reality -- I do not think he was trying to pull a 'Fast Jimmy' on me with them carbs. He came across as a nice, humble guy, just giving away a kz1000 to a stranger.

Find out what the cams are.

Are you absolutely certain there's an 1135 kit in the motor?

Are the coils stock?

Forget speculation on "why this" or "how come that". What matters to get it running properly and to get the correct advice is to find out exactly what you have to work with.

Get some photos if possible of the cams & carbs.

PS - some definitions need to be cleard up here...50's is old / 80's is ancient :laugh:

A man in his 20's /
A man in his 50's --
A man in his 80's \

Larry C

I think I'd have to measure the bores to verify the 1137cc kit which I have no plan on doing, as I do not intend to remove the head just to see if the old guy was bs'ing me.
This bike's got 140psi on all 4 cylinders and runs just fine, absolutely no reason to yank the head.


I totally get why it's important to know *for sure.*

But you know, you have to be able to assess the demeanor of people. And most of us (especially me at age 50) are pretty darn good at sizing up another feller's demeanor, as we have seen various shigga-moh-doo types of individuals come and go in our long life.

And I sized up this old feller, he has money, he has a house in Silicon Valley in a real upscale area, he has a polite and friendly family, and his son was right there confirming his dad put in the cams and the big bore kit.

I'll go with that.

And I can say with 100% certainty the carbs are the stock ones. When I pulled them off all the stock jets called out in the Factory Shop Manual for this bike were in them carbs.

And besides, my 2nd motorcycle I ever owned, bought new in 1977, was a '77 kz1000-A model. I remember that bike, I worked on that bike, the carbs on this '78 look *identical.*

So I REALLY like all you fellers helping me out! As I've learned a lot and will keep plowing forward on this one. Today I'm doing the valve check and will photograph the cams and get back to yall on the backside now.

Maybe you've seen, maybe not.... In in Word.doc Format...

Color Plug Chart to give you some ideas where your problem lies... Sweet!

kzrider.com/index.php?option=com_docman&...d&gid=448&Itemid=108