Stuck Kickstarter = Dead Bike

Well, engine doesn't turn counter-clockwise. Starter clutch investigation begins.

mind2find wrote:

Well, engine doesn't turn counter-clockwise. Starter clutch investigation begins.

I have my fingers crossed for you bud.
Keep us posted, I hope I can help you from my recent experience if you need it...

Opened up the left side of the engine and got as far as I could without the rotor puller. Didn't need a rotor holder to turn the reverse threaded bolt out.

I measured the inside of that thread which is 16mm so tomorrow I'm going to buy a 16mm bolt (with narrow threading I believe?) drill a hole through it, put a small handle through there and use it as a puller (all to avoid taking the back axle off.

If nothing looks messy in the clutch, I'll be back to ask what to rip apart next. I wonder if I can salvage any part of a seized engine. :blush:

mind2find wrote:

....all to avoid taking the back axle off...

Oh my god you are the most hard-working lazy person I've heard of. :blink: :lol:

...I have to admit, I bought a rotor puller from z1enterprises.com to do my *second* one... :blush: :whistle: one rear-wheel removal was enough... :lol:

www.z1enterprises.com/detail.aspx?ID=2163

EDIT Whoa wait a minute.... I forgot that the '76 and '77 have that other rotor... that's right you prolly do need the 16mm and the axle wouldn't work.... MY BAD... :blush:

Post edited by: Biquetoast, at: 2007/06/30 21:05

Yeah, the center stand was ripped off the bike far before I got it unfortunately. I do have a manual lift with straps to hold it steady.

i'd just have to put a block of wood between the lift and the bottom of the engine block so as to avoid crushing my exhaust pipes. :S i Ain't takin' those off right now. (last project before bike burnt was putting them on with new gaskets. )

thanks for the advice on how to be lazy. :woohoo:

mind2find wrote:

...thanks for the advice on how to be lazy. :woohoo:

Sorry about that.

I edited my post above about the earlier rotor. Here's the one you might need...

www.z1enterprises.com/detail.aspx?ID=2176

EDIT: Though I'm not 100% sure. I only know for a fact that mine is the 18mm (rear axle size)...

Post edited by: Biquetoast, at: 2007/07/02 06:02

Ok, so short of having the rotor puller in-hand (no matching bolt at the local hardware store :pinch: ) this is what things look like:



A & B bolts look like they are facing the wrong direction and C looks like it may have been sheared off on the end but it's hard to tell. No physical evidence of it. Are A & B supposed to look like that? Don't seem right.

Then in the 2nd and 3rd pics, there is evidence of metal shavings. Is this common in there or a sign of un-natural grinding.

Now I can't wait to pull that damn thing off!!!

mind2find wrote:

...A & B bolts look like they are facing the wrong direction...
...there is evidence of metal shavings. Is this common in there or a sign of un-natural grinding...

Remember, the bolts heard are on the other side. In pic A, you are looking at the bottom ends of them. Though it's hard for me to tell, it looks like they've backed out (toward the case). That's bad.

Also, metal shavings are bad. Not normal.

So my diagnosis from the photos is that one or more of your screws/bolts have backed out, possibly sheared off their heads, and got wedged in there. Just like my bike #2. We have to *hope* that's what happened, and that too much metal hasn't made its way through the rest of the engine. Here's another tip - you'll change the oil right away, of course due to the shavings, but you should also get a magnetic oil plug to try and catch the rest of the shavings over time.

By the way - how sure are you that the threads are 16mm for the puller? I've never dealt with a '76/'77, so I don't know. If I were you, I'd compare your measurements of the inner threads of the rotor with that of the rear axle nut (I know to be 18mm). In the manual I only see mention of ONE rotor puller, part # 57001-254, and no mention of size (or tool) difference between models.

Post edited by: Biquetoast, at: 2007/07/02 06:17

OK, well, the signs are bad but maybe the end result is not a piston seizure, which is good.

I used digital calipers to take the measurement on the inside (just right inside of the opening) for the puller on the threads, so pretty sure.

I'll get on the mag-oil-plug. Hopefully Z1 has it (or are those common-place?). Wish I had been able to combine it with the puller since I paid almost $7 in shipping for one bolt. :pinch:

I'll start cleaning up as much of the metal shavings as I can. The previous owner said they disconnected the starter motor (electrically) because of some awful grinding they would hear when they tried it, so god knows what the pre-existing condition was. Maybe I'll pull all of that apart while I've got the engine open.

Would flowing a quart of oil straight through the bike to flush any metal shavings work? Certainly it wouldn't catch them all but some is better than none.

since you are finding shavings, why not pull the pan and clean it out now, better to be safe

Maybe you just got a piece stuck in the kick start lever. Beter that then uder the drive chain:pinch: . I would pull the pan and side cover to make sure.

mind2find wrote:

...I'll get on the mag-oil-plug. Hopefully Z1 has it (or are those common-place?)....

I don't think so. I've bought a couple from eBay from different vendors, it's a multi-bike fit for Hondas and stuff, too.

...The previous owner said they disconnected the starter motor (electrically) because of some awful grinding they would hear when they tried it...

This is a major red flag. ALL OTHERS HEED THIS WARNING! Everyone: Unfortunately, you don't always get such a nice warning, but if you do, CHECK IT OUT!

...Would flowing a quart of oil straight through the bike to flush any metal shavings work? Certainly it wouldn't catch them all but some is better than none.

Perhaps, I cannot say. I suppose I agree that anything you do is better than nothing.

But I agree with BSKZ650, though I did not do that myself. I had super-fine metal particles on my magnetic plug in the next oil change though... Yours looks worse than mine though, as far as shavings.