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tricky clutch, needs work? fuel issue?
- tmeric7
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01 Sep 2022 11:18 #873180
by tmeric7
2020 Royal Enfield INT650
1981 Honda CM400
1978 KZ1000A2
1974 Suzi GT750
1971 Honda CL450
tricky clutch, needs work? fuel issue? was created by tmeric7
I have a 1987 KZ1000-A2, although it has A1 carbs. It has 26k miles. I've had it for 5 years, but much of that time it was not running. It looked great when I got it, but needed some attention. Spent some time not running. Everything I do I'm learning for the first time, so it takes a while. I got it running a year go after increasing the pilot jets and replacing the ignition coils. I've ridden it for 320 miles since then.
It is really hard to let out the clutch on this motorcycle. There is a thin margin between a jackrabbit start and a stall. It's like I don't know how to work a clutch. (I have two other motorcycles and all I drive is stick cars, for 20+ years.) I've never had to replace a clutch on anything I own, but this behavior is not what I normally associate with clutch failure. I honestly even tried practicing in my driveway, but in the end I feel like the motorcycle does not react in a consistent way to my use of the clutch and throttle, and it's really hard to ride the clutch (if I try) because the engagement travel distance on the clutch lever is really short.
Is this an issue that servicing the clutch can help with? I wonder also about fuel coming off idle hitting a lean spot because the jetting may not be matched right. It does rev and come down fine unloaded (stationary in neutral). It did stall coming to a stop once on a recent ride.
Work I did since owing it that I can remember: oil change (blackest stuff I ever saw, should probably change again, was thinking at 500 miles), adjusted valve clearance, cleaned and synced carbs (many times) replaces throttle cable, adjusted all carb and throttle specs, exhaust gaskets, tensioned cam chain, new battery, went over all electrical, bunch of other little things. Thanks!
It is really hard to let out the clutch on this motorcycle. There is a thin margin between a jackrabbit start and a stall. It's like I don't know how to work a clutch. (I have two other motorcycles and all I drive is stick cars, for 20+ years.) I've never had to replace a clutch on anything I own, but this behavior is not what I normally associate with clutch failure. I honestly even tried practicing in my driveway, but in the end I feel like the motorcycle does not react in a consistent way to my use of the clutch and throttle, and it's really hard to ride the clutch (if I try) because the engagement travel distance on the clutch lever is really short.
Is this an issue that servicing the clutch can help with? I wonder also about fuel coming off idle hitting a lean spot because the jetting may not be matched right. It does rev and come down fine unloaded (stationary in neutral). It did stall coming to a stop once on a recent ride.
Work I did since owing it that I can remember: oil change (blackest stuff I ever saw, should probably change again, was thinking at 500 miles), adjusted valve clearance, cleaned and synced carbs (many times) replaces throttle cable, adjusted all carb and throttle specs, exhaust gaskets, tensioned cam chain, new battery, went over all electrical, bunch of other little things. Thanks!
2020 Royal Enfield INT650
1981 Honda CM400
1978 KZ1000A2
1974 Suzi GT750
1971 Honda CL450
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- Wookie58
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01 Sep 2022 12:03 #873183
by Wookie58
Replied by Wookie58 on topic tricky clutch, needs work? fuel issue?
There are many on here that know these bikes far better than me but in the first instance I would suggest lubing the cable and check that it is routed correctly so there are no tight radius turns
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- Dr. Gamma
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01 Sep 2022 12:24 - 01 Sep 2022 21:59 #873185
by Dr. Gamma
1972 H2 750 Cafe Racer built in 1974.
1976 KH400 Production Road Racer.
1979 Kz1000 MK. II Old AMA/WERA Superbike.
1986 RG500G 2 stroke terror.
1986 GSXR750RG The one with the clutch that rattles!
Up in the hills near Prescott, Az.
Replied by Dr. Gamma on topic tricky clutch, needs work? fuel issue?
Besides checking the routing of the clutch cable. Look and see if it has come in contact with the exhaust pipes where the cable comes up the frame tube. If it is melted in that area replace the cable. It is a common problem when people put lower bars on the Kz1000 A model. Make sure cable is well lubed. The other problem area is the clutch release located in the sprocket cover. Make sure there are not any cracks in the outer clutch release white plastic piece. And not packed with gobs of dirt and old chain lube!!! Also that release should be packed with grease and should rotate freely when turned by hand. Is the clutch adjusted correctly?? Most Kawasaki bikes like to have a bit of free play at the clutch lever. Without any free play at the lever it makes the release point very narrow and not progressive.
The later model clutch release (1979~1981) is a far better quality clutch release than that white plastic thing. It is very common to upgrade to that later model clutch release.
Here is a picture of the late model Kz1000 clutch release. Best release Kawasaki ever put in their 4 cylinder bikes!!!! Drops right into your cover too!!!
The later model clutch release (1979~1981) is a far better quality clutch release than that white plastic thing. It is very common to upgrade to that later model clutch release.
Here is a picture of the late model Kz1000 clutch release. Best release Kawasaki ever put in their 4 cylinder bikes!!!! Drops right into your cover too!!!
1972 H2 750 Cafe Racer built in 1974.
1976 KH400 Production Road Racer.
1979 Kz1000 MK. II Old AMA/WERA Superbike.
1986 RG500G 2 stroke terror.
1986 GSXR750RG The one with the clutch that rattles!
Up in the hills near Prescott, Az.
Last edit: 01 Sep 2022 21:59 by Dr. Gamma.
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- Irish Yobbo
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01 Sep 2022 18:00 #873199
by Irish Yobbo
1981 KZ750 LTD
Replied by Irish Yobbo on topic tricky clutch, needs work? fuel issue?
Both good ideas from Wookie and Dr Gamma. Even if your clutch release is OK it's worth taking it off for a clean, greasing, and reassembly.
The next thing I'd recommend checking is your clutch actuator rod (the rod pressed by the clutch release under the sprocket cover). These can wear where they rub the housing, and can develop grooves which can catch on the housing and can suddenly release as you let out the lever, and it will feel like you've dropped the clutch. Pull the rod out and inspect it - if it's bent replace it, if it's got grooves you can just turn it around and put it back in the other way, that way the housing will be rubbing where the rod isn't worn.
The next thing I'd recommend checking is your clutch actuator rod (the rod pressed by the clutch release under the sprocket cover). These can wear where they rub the housing, and can develop grooves which can catch on the housing and can suddenly release as you let out the lever, and it will feel like you've dropped the clutch. Pull the rod out and inspect it - if it's bent replace it, if it's got grooves you can just turn it around and put it back in the other way, that way the housing will be rubbing where the rod isn't worn.
1981 KZ750 LTD
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- Nessism
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01 Sep 2022 18:28 - 01 Sep 2022 18:46 #873200
by Nessism
Replied by Nessism on topic tricky clutch, needs work? fuel issue?
Ditch the cable and purchase a new one. Then lube before install. A new cable is a thing of beauty, far better than an old one that's lubed. Oh, and get a OEM cable. Not a motion pro or some other aftermarket cable.
Also, as mentioned, get a new style three ball ramp mechanism. They are way better than the older release mechanism. My 1981 750 had the better ramp mechanism, but a 1980 parts engine I bought didn't. I'd look for cheap later year sprocket cover and take the mechanism from it.
Also, as mentioned, get a new style three ball ramp mechanism. They are way better than the older release mechanism. My 1981 750 had the better ramp mechanism, but a 1980 parts engine I bought didn't. I'd look for cheap later year sprocket cover and take the mechanism from it.
Last edit: 01 Sep 2022 18:46 by Nessism.
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- hardrockminer
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01 Sep 2022 18:56 #873201
by hardrockminer
I have several restored bikes along with a 2006 Goldwing with a sidecar. My wife has a 2019 Suzuki DR 650 for on and off road.
Replied by hardrockminer on topic tricky clutch, needs work? fuel issue?
Do you have a manual for the bike? If not, you should download the one from this site. There is a lot of information in there on how to properly set up the clutch release.
Just to be clear....you said the bike is a 1987 A2. I suspect you meant a 1977 A2. The A2 is from the 1978 model year. What are the frame and engine S/N?
You said you have A1 carbs on the bike. Do they have both the fuel/air screw on the side and a pilot fuel screw on the bottom?
Have you checked your clutch plates? They can be accessed from the right side of the engine...the rear engine cover....the big one where you check your oil level. You will have to drain the oil before removing the cover unless the bike is on the side stand.
Just to be clear....you said the bike is a 1987 A2. I suspect you meant a 1977 A2. The A2 is from the 1978 model year. What are the frame and engine S/N?
You said you have A1 carbs on the bike. Do they have both the fuel/air screw on the side and a pilot fuel screw on the bottom?
Have you checked your clutch plates? They can be accessed from the right side of the engine...the rear engine cover....the big one where you check your oil level. You will have to drain the oil before removing the cover unless the bike is on the side stand.
I have several restored bikes along with a 2006 Goldwing with a sidecar. My wife has a 2019 Suzuki DR 650 for on and off road.
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- tmeric7
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06 Sep 2022 04:55 #873424
by tmeric7
2020 Royal Enfield INT650
1981 Honda CM400
1978 KZ1000A2
1974 Suzi GT750
1971 Honda CL450
Replied by tmeric7 on topic tricky clutch, needs work? fuel issue?
Thanks for all the suggestions everyone. I will work through these over the next few weeks or so. My progress is never fast, but I will report back how it goes... eventually.
Yes, I have the manual, thanks. Sorry for the typo, it's a 1978 A2. The frame no. is KZT00A-030061. The engine no. is KZT00AE 046957. I forget exactly how I determined that the carbs, and maybe some other parts, are A1. There is not an air screw on the side, only a fuel screw on the bottom. Jetting was consistent with A1 specs.
Thanks again!
Yes, I have the manual, thanks. Sorry for the typo, it's a 1978 A2. The frame no. is KZT00A-030061. The engine no. is KZT00AE 046957. I forget exactly how I determined that the carbs, and maybe some other parts, are A1. There is not an air screw on the side, only a fuel screw on the bottom. Jetting was consistent with A1 specs.
Thanks again!
2020 Royal Enfield INT650
1981 Honda CM400
1978 KZ1000A2
1974 Suzi GT750
1971 Honda CL450
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- Mikaw
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06 Sep 2022 05:36 #873433
by Mikaw
1976 KZ 900 A4 kzrider.com/forum/11-projects/613548-1976-kz-900-a4
1976 KZ 900 B1 LTD
1978 KZ 1000 B2 LTD
1980 KZ 750 E1
Kowledge Speaks, But Wisdom Listens.
Jimi Hendrix.
Replied by Mikaw on topic tricky clutch, needs work? fuel issue?
Good luck, help us satisfy an itch. Post some pictures please.
1976 KZ 900 A4 kzrider.com/forum/11-projects/613548-1976-kz-900-a4
1976 KZ 900 B1 LTD
1978 KZ 1000 B2 LTD
1980 KZ 750 E1
Kowledge Speaks, But Wisdom Listens.
Jimi Hendrix.
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- hardrockminer
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06 Sep 2022 08:15 #873448
by hardrockminer
I have several restored bikes along with a 2006 Goldwing with a sidecar. My wife has a 2019 Suzuki DR 650 for on and off road.
Replied by hardrockminer on topic tricky clutch, needs work? fuel issue?
I believe A1 carbs had both pilot fuel and fuel/air screws. Do your carbs have a pump on the bottom of #2 or #3 carb?
I have several restored bikes along with a 2006 Goldwing with a sidecar. My wife has a 2019 Suzuki DR 650 for on and off road.
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- Mikaw
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06 Sep 2022 19:04 #873486
by Mikaw
1976 KZ 900 A4 kzrider.com/forum/11-projects/613548-1976-kz-900-a4
1976 KZ 900 B1 LTD
1978 KZ 1000 B2 LTD
1980 KZ 750 E1
Kowledge Speaks, But Wisdom Listens.
Jimi Hendrix.
Replied by Mikaw on topic tricky clutch, needs work? fuel issue?
In my experience on Suzuki Mikuni had both fuel and air pilots.I believe A1 carbs had both pilot fuel and fuel/air screws. Do your carbs have a pump on the bottom of #2 or #3 carb?
1976 KZ 900 A4 kzrider.com/forum/11-projects/613548-1976-kz-900-a4
1976 KZ 900 B1 LTD
1978 KZ 1000 B2 LTD
1980 KZ 750 E1
Kowledge Speaks, But Wisdom Listens.
Jimi Hendrix.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Nessism
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- gd4now
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- Denco where did you go?
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07 Sep 2022 08:33 #873501
by gd4now
1977 KZ650 B1
Pods and Denco header
OLD KAW OWNERS SMILE ALOT
Replied by gd4now on topic tricky clutch, needs work? fuel issue?
As I understand it Milkaw is correct. I am not aware of any of the vm26ss carbs that came stock on 900/1000 kaws had both an air screw and a pilot screw, it was one or the other only. While the vm26ss carbs that came stock on the Suzuki GS models did come with both.
1977 KZ650 B1
Pods and Denco header
OLD KAW OWNERS SMILE ALOT
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- Nerdy
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07 Sep 2022 11:08 #873510
by Nerdy
Will pulling the rod out allow the single ball bearing [on the clutch end of the rod] to move out of place? Part #19 here: www.partzilla.com/catalog/kawasaki/motor...utch-77-78-a1-a2-a2a
Or will the ball bearing stay in place if the bike is vertical? Seems like it should but would like to confirm.
The 440A engine I'm working on had a similar cam-type clutch actuator but it was missing when I got the engine - had to go to three different ebay sellers to get the cable, the cam actuator assembly, and the sprocket cover itself (but was happy to be able to get everything). I'd like to replace the pushrod as well but didn't want to lose my bearing. Hmm - actually at this point I should be able to tip the engine over to the right and remove the pushrod that way.
1979 KZ400 Gifted to a couple of nephews
1967 Yamaha YCS1 Bonanza
1980 KZ440B
1981 Yamaha XT250H
1981 KZ440 LTD project bike
1981 GPz550
2013 Yamaha FZ6R
Replied by Nerdy on topic tricky clutch, needs work? fuel issue?
Both good ideas from Wookie and Dr Gamma. Even if your clutch release is OK it's worth taking it off for a clean, greasing, and reassembly.
The next thing I'd recommend checking is your clutch actuator rod (the rod pressed by the clutch release under the sprocket cover). These can wear where they rub the housing, and can develop grooves which can catch on the housing and can suddenly release as you let out the lever, and it will feel like you've dropped the clutch. Pull the rod out and inspect it - if it's bent replace it, if it's got grooves you can just turn it around and put it back in the other way, that way the housing will be rubbing where the rod isn't worn.
Will pulling the rod out allow the single ball bearing [on the clutch end of the rod] to move out of place? Part #19 here: www.partzilla.com/catalog/kawasaki/motor...utch-77-78-a1-a2-a2a
Or will the ball bearing stay in place if the bike is vertical? Seems like it should but would like to confirm.
The 440A engine I'm working on had a similar cam-type clutch actuator but it was missing when I got the engine - had to go to three different ebay sellers to get the cable, the cam actuator assembly, and the sprocket cover itself (but was happy to be able to get everything). I'd like to replace the pushrod as well but didn't want to lose my bearing. Hmm - actually at this point I should be able to tip the engine over to the right and remove the pushrod that way.
1967 Yamaha YCS1 Bonanza
1980 KZ440B
1981 Yamaha XT250H
1981 KZ440 LTD project bike
1981 GPz550
2013 Yamaha FZ6R
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