First Ride: Three new problems.

So I took the 440 (1980-B1)out for it's first ride yesterday; a whoppin' 10 miles. It responds to throttle, gets around corners OK and stopping is much less of an adventure than I expected with the drum front brake.

Of course, riding is different than sitting in the garage, and I found two new and one old problem that I thought I had fixed.

First, the speedometer is wonky. I may have solved that with some cleaning and refitting. I'll find out later. It's not a big concern.

Second, the "won't return to idle" problem reappeared. It fires right up cold or warm, doesn't ask for much choke (or any) either way, and settles into a nice 1,400 rpm idle. But, after riding, it wants to idle at 2,000+. I thought that I had that one with new points and proper timing. At least it wasn't a problem in the garage. It has a stock air box, the timing is "right" as is the valve lash. There are no air or fuel leaks that I can find. I checked on and cleaned up the timing advance (but did NOT lube the points cam as I didn't trust my tool kit). This seems to put me back into the carbs. I expect that I need to synchronize them, but of course I don't have the meters to do that. I could also, I suppose, have screwed up an idle circuit when I rebuilt them. They're a long story.

Third, when it's fully heated up, it doesn't want to start at all. Coil? I'm hoping so and I'll check that as best I can with an ohmeter. I do have a backup.

At this point I may have exceeded my sorry mechanical skills and poorly stocked tool box. Anybody have a favorite old bike mechanic in Lincoln, NE?

Still, it does run, and that's a good thing. Repaired saddle goes on this week, and I'll post some pictures.

Have you tries to bump/push start it hot? Could be starter, or could be very lean.
Maybe its just a poorly tuned pilot mixture.
Tune your mixture/air screws as per manual and then have a go at it.

1400 is a pretty high idle, it should be more like 800-1000 when just started up and off choke. You wont get the engine up to the correct idle till after several minutes of riding because it really does take that long to get the engine to full temperature.

Good luck.

i see the beemers coming back to haught you J/K

yes that idle is high set it when motor is fully warmed up

check them air mixture screws count the number of turns to close but dont FORCE it tight!!!
give us a holler

Before adjusting mixture and air screws, spray some carb cleaner, or other flammable aerosol around the carb boots. Also check there for cracks in your vacuum lines, and plugs. Could be a vacuum leak causing high idle/lean conditions.

Yep. That's pretty much how it works. When I said it "settled in" I meant as it warms on starting.

I've spent a lot of time looking for those leaks. New intake boots, new plugs, carefully reconstructed air box. I can't find a leak anywhere, but I'll keep looking. Never tried the "flammable aerosol" bit, but I will. Thanks.

The spray method is probably the easiest way to be sure if you have leaks, and track them down. With the engine running, spray the substance all over your carb boots from all sides. If there is a leak, the liquid will be sucked into the engine and you will notice a brief rpm increase. Just something to check and make sure of before you go in any other direction

sounds to me the floats are little to hi so it is getting little to much fuel and is all most fluded when it is wormed up but not to much to start when cold

my two cents

Used your technique, and found no problems. So, I'm reasonably confident that there is no air leak. Thanks for the advice. It's a simple test.

Checked that out using the clear tube method. The floats were indeed wrong, but they were both low. I'm not sure that's my problem, but it is something to tend to while the carbs are off the bike. Thanks.

I'm on to this problem now. The shop manual is specific for opening the pilot screw on non-US models (2-3/4 turns), but for the US model it just says to count the turns when removing the screw and to put them back in the same way. The problem is that these things had been "rebuilt" before I got in there and since a lot of stuff was screwed up, I have no idea if what I found was correct. I've posted in the carb section of the forum looking for advice on this one. If you know the answer (How many turns for the pilot screws on Keihin 36mm CV carbs?), please let me know. Otherwise, thanks for the advice.

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