TOPIC:

I need to replace the rear line on my 198 KZ1000 LDT.  I haven't have any luck finding the right pieces to put together a line with the screw-in banjos but I happened upon the HEL website with their custom brake lines.  So my first question is -- is their quality worth the price?  Judging by their online tool, it should be $63 for the line I need.

Assuming they do make a good quality product, could someone please double-check my work before I place an order?  I measured 15.25" center-to-center between the banjos.  The caliper end takes a straight banjo, but it looks like a 20deg bend on the master cylinder end will give a better alignment.  I am very uncertain about the rubber supports though?  I think the rubber doughnut grommet most closely matches the original, but does anyone know if that fits in the stock support clips on the frame or should I pick something different?

If I can get this much figured out then I'll also grab a new pack of crush washers, and I think that should be it?  The weather is turning finally so I need to pull the caliper apart again and try to clean out whatever debris keeps locking it up, and maybe this year I can finally get a season of riding.

Nothing wrong with Hel, They are high quality and I will be using them on my bike with no hesitation...   PS  I'm fussy as can be...

I’ve used Hel lines on my bike front and back. Great quality.
Only issue I had was they are considerably thinner than stock so the rear wouldn’t stay in the swingarm mounts.
So i cut a bit of fuel pipe to put over the lines where they push into the mounts to keep them in place.

Sounds promising, thanks for the recommendations!  I assume "thinner" means "made with more modern materials"?

So should I not include the rubber grommets at all for my order?  Memory tells me the grommets on the original brake line are molded in place and not removable, so I'm still confused about that aspect of my order.

Yes, the originals pipes are usual made from thick rubber, the Hels have a much thinner diameter - pretty much like all braided lines.

Are the grommets you refer to like the ones in the picture below.

If so, I would order them as they will fit the metal attachment hooks. You then need to add something around the Hel line to hold it snug within the grommet - you could try putting a bit of fuel line around to take up the slack and gluing it in place or try to source grommets with a smaller inner diameter.

It might not be strictly necessary but at least it might stop the line rattling around.
 

You can make your own line from Earl's parts for cheaper.  All the parts are made in USA and easy to put together.  I've got a tutorial in my KZ750 rebuild thread.  I mention this because it's a crap shoot regarding buying a premade line and getting all the angles and lengths perfectly correct for your bike.  If you changed handlebars, master cylinder, anything, then the stock configuration may not fit perfectly.  Not to mention, some of these brake line makers don't get the specs perfect for every bike anyway.

@woodyvale -- yes the #14 grommets is what I'm referring to.  Since HEL sells the grommets are part of the new brake like I would assume they would already fit correctly, the only question is whether those new grommets fit inside the stock wire hook.

@Nessism -- I've seen a number of places that have screw-in banjos, but not one of them actually provided a useful measurement so I could determine the right length of hose with stainless fittings to use (it's probably either 13" or 14" but who knows?).  There's really no trick to getting a good fit on my bike, it's the rear hose and pretty much all stock equipment.  The original (and I do mean original!) line appears to be slightly longer than needed, and it looked like an angled banjo on one end would be more in line with how the hose is routed along the frame.  The HEL line I was looking at is from their customizer: you pick the banjos, grommets, color of the protective sleeve, and then select how long you want the total length between banjo centers and they make that exact hose for you.  Pretty much comes down to the accuracy of my measurements, but I measured 16" end-to-end and 3/8" from end to center of the banjos, so 15.25" center-to-center should be perfect?  However I'm not familiar with Earl's... google gives me a link on ebay that looks like who you might be referring to, but I wasn't sure about their direct website?

Ordered a complete HEL set for my KZ1100 in 2016.  My bike's swingarm has two grommets/holders.  HEL supplied one grommet insert instead of two, and made the line an inch too long besides...

When made aware of the issues, HEL without hesitation fixed the length and added the second grommet insert on the brake line before crimping on the new end. The grommet insert fits snugly inside the oem grommet, and has enlarged ends that lock it in place.







HEL contact information as printed on my warranty brochure below:

HEL Performance USA
Technical / Installation Support
www.HELusa.com
1-877-416-0969

...and on website:
913-730-7500
 

Oh interesting, I see what you did with the grommets there.  I wouldn't have thought of doing it that way!  And judging by your picture, it looks like the OEM grommets are actually split?  I didn't remember that being the case, but it's been a few years since I built my bike.

I also see you got one angled banjo just like I was planning to do, nice to see it actually fits as well as I hoped.

Any chance you remember what length of hose you ordered?

Here is where I get Earl's parts.  Speed Seal w/teflon line is designed for brake systems.

I'm not trying to talk you out of HEL.  I've just seen too many stories like Dave's where the line didn't fit right, and with Earl's you can make sure of the fit during assembly.

www.anplumbing.com/ptfe-hoses-and-hose-e...e-ends-in-steel.html

Sorry @Nessism, I thought I had responded to this.  Thanks for the link to Earl's, by the domain name it's not one I would have thought to check.   I've been looking at both sites, one way or the other I'll get a new brake line this year and hopefully solve the problem of the rear caliper not releasing.

Just coming back to this post and thought I'd give an update on what's been happening.  So initially I tried to place an order with the US West office but then realized there was no way to select my shipping preferences, so I sent an email to the U.S. HEL address but never received a reply.  In April I reached out on twitter and got a response, was given an email address to correspond with and told later in the week that they had identified the problem and would let me know when it was fixed.  I checked the order page again in May and still had no options to complete my order so I sent a couple more emails over the next week to the address I had been given, but never received any replies there.  Sheesh.

Finally last month the option to finalize my order was fixed, so went ahead and submitted it, got an immediate confirmation email, and a second email the next day saying my order was accepted.  Great!  And then nothing...  Since my previous emails had been ignored I reached out on twitter again last week, providing my order number and asking if they could check on the status (I don't know how long it actually takes to make a new line, or if there are delays from waiting on parts like so many other industries?) but nobody has responded.  I sent another tweet to them again today, don't know if I'll hear anything, but it this point it's unlikely that I'll get to ride my bike at all this season.  Unfortunate, considering the cost of gas over the past couple months!

Regardless, I have to say I'm really disappointed.  I went with HEL because of the great experience others have had with them but something appears to have changed.  Maybe I will eventually get my new brake line, or maybe I'll have to get one from somebody else -- I guess we'll see.