Soft Front Brake

Just put in new front brake pads on my -81 Gpz 1100 which btw has dual front discs.
Prior to this I had OK firm feeling lever but only 2mm left on pads. After installing new pads and new DOT3 fluid and a couple of hours of bleeding, I can not get a firm brake handle/lever. The lever goes all the way in to the handle bar and only there applies the brakes.

Could I still have air after a couple of 12ounce bottles of new fluid and bleeding? I first did the manual bleed per manual. When that didn't work I did the vacuum pump at the caliper, same result...
I saw somewhere here on the board that air can be trapped in the master cyl at handle and require removal...maybe next step.
Or any other ideas? Does the master cyl have plastic seals inside that can be replaced (like on cars)?

Thanks:huh:

I used to have the same problem, yes there is still air trapped someplace in the system. I solved the problem by making an adapter (out of an old reservoir cap) for my pressure tank bleeder. If you can find someone with a pressure bleeder it's WELL worth the effort to make an adapter and use the bleeder. I replace the fluid in my front and rear every year now with no more trapped air and it only takes 15 minutes. Ed

did you clean the crud out of bottem of master cylinder ?zip tie the lever to the handle bars and leave it overnight then crack your bleeder open,you might be suprised

Apex, Yes and Yes. Since you've been able to process lots of fluid, you have at least enough pressure in system to get flow. a couple of tips which might help. 1,Gently attempt to push pads back into caliper. this will insure the return bleed to master cyl res. is clear.2, locate bike so that hoses/calipers/junction block would allow any trapped air in system to rise.let sit for 5, then arrange bike/hbars so that the travel of master cyl's piston is level. gently work lever and look for air returning to res. in most cases system will bleed air out. anouther messier approche is to apply pressure at lever and crack banjo bolts at any junction you suspect an air bubble might reside. bear in mind, brake fluid eats paint & plastic. take care. anouther more time consuming trick is to zip tie lever @ 1 inch from bar and let sit-say over night.and re-check. if this provides adaquate lever pressure, ride.. air will continue to rise and evacuate. in truely obsinant cases, I've been known to remove sealed system from bike and suspend at various angles for extended periods. hope this makes sense/ helps.G

Thanks Everybody for ideas!
I now have a really firm lever and great front brakes.
Ended up trying the tie-wrap of lever to handle-bar over-night. Quite a bit of air on release of bleeder, and better lever. But it still took a lot more manual bleeding to get perfect firm feeling brakes. I went through a total of 44 ounces of fluid, including the rear brake (which was only maybe 12 of this and a piece of cake).
Maybe a bit of overkill, but I want to be 100% sure of my brakes. BTW it was about six years since last fluid change and everything wass very clean inside reservoirs - no deposits whatsoever only slighty darker fluid. Of course it does absorb water in the long run so it is better to replace maybe every 3-4 years.

Enjoy your old classic muscle bikes, I love mine on the twisties!

Awesome! I hate bleeding brakes lol.