kz750 bastard without a spark

More
18 Jun 2020 02:47 - 18 Jun 2020 05:56 #828371 by Pindakaas
kz750 bastard without a spark was created by Pindakaas
Hello, ik have recently bought a kz650 with a 750 engine, a zephyr head, wiring from a bike that might be neather a 650 nor a 750 i dont know , wheels from a modern z, i saw this beautifull bike, but the owner never got it running, some serious work has gone into it, but without a running engine it ended up in his garage en now ive bought it for a fair price. Now i have to solve the problem the previous owner couldnt solve.
I have experience with bikes, but this is my first Kawasaki, love the bike, but it i dont have the knowledge yet to get it running, so im hoping you guys can help.
What have i done so far? I have swapped the ignition coils, no effect, sthe spark plugs are good, i have ordered an other igniter, still no spark. Then you might think the pickup coils are bad, but the seem ok, within tolerance according to my meter. So, whe have all good parts but still no spark.
Could it be that de igniter and the pickup coils not match? Have i overlooked anything?
because this is a bike made out of different models by someone else anything could be wrong, maybe even the connector.The previeous owner placed the wiring from another bike, probable used the matching ignitor, because there are no modifications on the connector.
Are there alternative ignition systems i can use to get it going?

This is the bike:


Pictures from the setup:
igniter:

Pickup coils:

Last edit: 18 Jun 2020 05:56 by Pindakaas. Reason: Better title

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
18 Jun 2020 07:44 - 18 Jun 2020 07:52 #828379 by loudhvx
Replied by loudhvx on topic kz750 bastard without a spark
That's the wrong igniter for those pickups.

Your pickups use a mechanical-advance device. The igniter is from a later electronic-advance system.

If the pickups are good, you will want to make sure the advancer is working. Then you need the small metal ic igniter.

You may be able to make one if you cant find one.
s3.amazonaws.com/gpzweb/Ignition/GPZgmHEImod.html

You probably have the wiring issues as well.
Post photos of the regulator if you can.
Last edit: 18 Jun 2020 07:52 by loudhvx.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
18 Jun 2020 12:45 #828399 by Pindakaas
Replied by Pindakaas on topic kz750 bastard without a spark
Thx, i wil get the other igniter. This one i think? igniterhttps://www.motorparts-online.com/nl/kawasaki/z-750/1980-1986/cdi-ecu-unit/201408987
I'll post a picture from the regulator, but i havent tested it yet, thx for the headsup.
Im starting to think its a lot easyer to put in an m-unit and do all the wiring again.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
18 Jun 2020 13:17 #828401 by Pindakaas
Replied by Pindakaas on topic kz750 bastard without a spark
I have a spare bike in the garage, a kz650 with a newtronic ingnition, would that work on the 750?

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
18 Jun 2020 15:06 #828413 by F64
Replied by F64 on topic kz750 bastard without a spark
If your horn, turn signals, start button, hi/lo beams work; you may stay with the current harness.
The m-unit uses ground switched inputs. All of your handlebar inputs have to be switched from 12v to ground.
It can be a fun time, but plan on a couple days of re-wiring.

81-KZ440-D2.
Louis Dudzik's GM HEI ignitor conversion installed 2015 s3.amazonaws.com/gpzweb/Ignition/GPZgmHEImod.html
Motogadget m-unit blue installed 2017.
LIC, NY

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
19 Jun 2020 07:51 #828454 by rangeroy
Replied by rangeroy on topic kz750 bastard without a spark
Loudhvx is correct you have the wrong pickups for that igniter if it was me I would just put on the Techtronic system it will bolt straight on, I have used that make on various Kwaks z650,gpz 750,z1b &z1r with no worries/problems it needs the mechanical advance/retard that's sat behind the pickup plate
with the system you have on at the moment you could change the pickups to gpz 750 instead of the igniter.
good luck
this is what I had & Loudhvx told me what to use
gpz pickups
this is the set up just half removed the techtronic system to see if the 750 pickups & 550 igniter would work, they do :)

1977 z650
Attachments:

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
20 Jun 2020 03:03 #828509 by Pindakaas
Replied by Pindakaas on topic kz750 bastard without a spark
It seems I have a few options. My first target is to make sure the engine is working before i start buying expensive stuff, so I'm going to try the newtronic from the other bike. If it runs I'm going to get a dyna s, I think.
Thx for the response, I'll try it this week.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
20 Jun 2020 07:45 - 20 Jun 2020 07:49 #828519 by loudhvx
Replied by loudhvx on topic kz750 bastard without a spark
I've worked with Newtronic systems over the years and they seemed more sensitive to voltage issues, especially low voltage. I was also not impressed by the small gauge wire they use. When the wire breaks, it's a pain to fix it. There were also some lawsuits related to Newtronic back in the late 1990's and early 2000's but I'm not sure if they were reliability related or not. A good one seems to work well. A bad one is a headache.

I think I would trust a Dyna S more readily. Dyna has proven to be a great company to do business with.

But in my opinion, the best design is the factory unit (both the early mechanical-advance and later electronic-advance). They don't energize the coils until the crank is actually turning. This is far more efficient and safer in case you leave the key turned on.

If you think you want to rewire the bike, I can draw up a simplified diagram so you can just wire the components directly.
Last edit: 20 Jun 2020 07:49 by loudhvx.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Pindakaas

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
22 Jun 2020 07:22 #828655 by Pindakaas
Replied by Pindakaas on topic kz750 bastard without a spark

loudhvx wrote: I've worked with Newtronic systems over the years and they seemed more sensitive to voltage issues, especially low voltage. I was also not impressed by the small gauge wire they use. When the wire breaks, it's a pain to fix it. There were also some lawsuits related to Newtronic back in the late 1990's and early 2000's but I'm not sure if they were reliability related or not. A good one seems to work well. A bad one is a headache.

I think I would trust a Dyna S more readily. Dyna has proven to be a great company to do business with.

But in my opinion, the best design is the factory unit (both the early mechanical-advance and later electronic-advance). They don't energize the coils until the crank is actually turning. This is far more efficient and safer in case you leave the key turned on.

If you think you want to rewire the bike, I can draw up a simplified diagram so you can just wire the components directly.

Thats good info, i will keep that in mind. Mission 1 is to test the engine from the bike i bought. I have the newtronic in the other kz zo im just using it for testing the engine and if it works ill buy the dyna and put back the newtronic in the other bike. If the engine is junk i'm using the other bike as a donor. I'm going to rebuild the bike, some welds are messy, engine needs attention and the wiring is a mess, it seems to work, but its not what the bike deserves. i only have a few hours a week to work on it, so it will take a while. A simplified diagram would be very helpfull, but im not sure wether to go for an m-unit or build it without. M-unit makes it simple, but its expensive becasue i will allso need switches and other stuff. I wouldnt ask you to draw a diagram if i'm not going to use it, dont want to waste your time.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
25 Jun 2020 13:36 #828984 by Pindakaas
Replied by Pindakaas on topic kz750 bastard without a spark
today itook the newtronic ignition and put it in the z750 and with a little hessitation i got it running! Thx everyone for the advise, i would never have guessed it on my own.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Powered by Kunena Forum