No spark, where to start?

Hi guys! Not sure if this question specific to me has been asked or solved yet, haven't found much of anything when I've searched and please redirect me if this has already been solved for someone! I have no spark as the title implies on my '81 Kz440 LTD, which I've come to the conclusion on by grounding a brand new plug attached to the plug wire on the engine and nothing. I have the service manual (which has been helping me so much the past 7/8 years) and the diagnosis for no spark, ruling out the plug itself is the ignition coil and the points/ condenser, but the pictures and directions in my manual don't have what I do, it's the black box with a blue and black wire attached. Also, I've tried with my multimeter to measure DCV at the coil leads w/ ignition on and do not have a reading, which inclines me to think that my coil could be bad. Any help and suggestions would be appreciated! Also, I've attached pictures of the black box I was talking about the not in my manual and my ignition coil, and the patch by the PO that I've also tested DCV to no avail.

That black box, in your hand, is the pickup coil. You should be able to trace the wiring back to where it plugs into the harness or ICU., Unplug it and measure resistance across the two wires. If your ohm meter shows and open the pickup is bad. It should read some resistance, indicated in your service manual, like 330 ohms for example. If the resistance is within the manual spec then you can be sure that is not your problem. Make sure the run/kill switch is in the run position. Lots of us have made that mistake before.

No eBay APP ID and/or Cert ID defined in Kunena configurationThank you for the response! I've done so much research in about the past month, managed to get my hands on a new ignition coil, found some grounds that needed to be taken care of and tested, tested, tested! I am getting battery voltage to my ignition coil, wires and caps check out, CDI unit (that's the name, right? Black box that receives a 3-pin and 2-pin connector to the pickup coil) is receiving and spitting out the right numbers, alas the pickup coil is bad - I have no resistance when I test @ 20 ohms, not even moving the multimeter at all.

I'm learning that this seems to be a deal breaker searching throughout the forums, but I did find something that (maybe) might work on Ebay, obviously I would have to affix it to a plate and make sure that the gap would be the same but what the odds that this may solve my problem?



Thank you in advance!

You are correct that the pulsing coil is no longer available new, but you should be able to find a functioning used one. According to Partzilla, that exact part was used on the 1980-83 440LTD as well as the 1982 750CSR twin. I would bet real money the actual coil was used on other models as well, with a slightly different mounting plate or wire harness. If you want to try one from a different model, be sure the coil itself looks exactly the same and be sure to use the mounting screw it comes with. Evidently, some use steel screws and others use brass screws, and using the wrong screws will affect the coil's function.
By the way, KZs do not have CDI. The component you refer to is called the igniter.

(I have been trying to edit this message for a while, but my connection to KZR seems really unstable this morning. Sorry.)

The ignition info you need is in a supplemental chapter near the back of the fsm, starting on page 271.

In addition to what Texas said...

You said you measured the pickups using the 20 ohm scale, is that correct?
Is it a digital meter or analog? A digital meter will show a good pickup as an open circuit on a 20 ohms scale. You need to use a 500 ohm or 1000 ohm scale (aka 1K scale) or greater in order to properly measure the pickup. I can help you with that if you get that pickup.

If it's an analog meter, it may move the needle a tiny bit, but not by a readable amount.

And yes, there is a chance that ebay pickup might work. You will want to make sure there is a magnet inside that pickup by putting a screwdriver etc. near the pickup pole. You will need to get the polarity on the wires correct. That can be done with a meter, preferably digital.

Texas-
My mistake, I've been doing so much looking into things I mixed up a CDI with the igniter and was flustered when I wrote the post! I do have the service manual and the part in it that you're talking about, the 1981 supplement section has been INVALUABLE to me these past few months. For the longest time I had no idea what was going on with my *points* because that's the only option that the book has and since I discovered that section and seen the pickup coil in there I was so relieved that no one did something crazy to the bike in the past to get it running! As for looking for the part, I've looked for a few days and yeah, obviously bikebandit and partzilla, Z1, etc. have nothing of the sorts in stock and I know there's about a 3% chance in finding a new one altogether, but for some reason I cannot for the life of me find even a used one anywhere! I've even just put in generic terms like "KZ440 Ignition" and the sorts to no avail, I have seen ones that are the full wheel part and have what seems like 2 pickup coils on them across from each other but that scared me away... So if that one would work (I think they're from similar era bikes, I'd have to find an example) let me know, or conversely if you have some places I could check for used ones, PLEASE let me know, that would help greatly!

Loudhvx-
I am an idiot and I apologize for that, it is a digital meter and in the service manual I have it says to test at the 100 ohm level, so I was in fact using 200 not 20 ohm, my mistake! The reading in manual also says that it should come out to anywhere between 360 and 540 which am not getting, it is staying completely at 1. I've tried all sorts of different things like different options on the meter (20, 200, 2k), switching the connections (IE red to blue and black to black then black to blue and red to black), even making sure everything was cleaned with contact cleaner.

As for the Ebay pickup that I listed, I ended up buying this morning since I couldn't find anything even remotely close last night, I'm justifying that by the look of the pickup and the fact that wires are blue and black like mine currently are (stock), so I am hopeful that one will work and I'll be able to mock something up!

A dual coil plate from a contemporary KZ could work by removing one and installing it on your plate.

The range on analog meters mean different things than the range on digital meters.

An analog meter will often have a scale multiplier like " x 100 ohm". That means to multiply what you read on the scale by 100.
A digital meter will have a scale number meaning the maximum resistance it can measure on that scale. Any more will read as infinite resistance.

The pickup should read around 450 ohms, but can vary roughly +/- 100 ohms.

With your digital meter having the option of 20, 200, and 2K, only the 2K range would be able to read the pickup. For reading ohms on a pickup, the polarity doesn't matter. Since you read infinite (that is usually what the "1" on the left side side of the readout means), it's a good indicator your pickup is bad (open).

In my earlier post, I mention the importance of polarity when it comes time to install that pickup. I meant to say I can help you determine the polarity if you buy the ebay pickup.

Basically, connect the meter to the pickup and set it to the lowest DC voltage scale you have... maybe .2v or 2v.
Then touch a screwdriver to the center of the pickup. It should stick since it should have a permanent magnet in it. Let the meter come back to rest to reading 0v. Then pull the screwdriver away quickly, but smoothly. Look at the voltage. You don't care what the value is, but you care whether or not the voltage is positive or negative. Negative will have a minus sign.

Flip the meter leads and confirm the voltage polarity now reads the opposite of what it did before.

Connect the meter once again so that it reads negative when you pull the screwdriver away.
Do this a bunch of times to be sure to get consistent results.

The red meter lead is connected to the positive wire of the new pickup .
The black meter lead is connected to the negative wire of the new pickup.

On your original pickup, the positive wire is black.
On your original pickup, the negative wire is blue.

Please post a resistance value for that new pickup too.

Guys! I found one on Ebay almost ten minutes ago, the seller isn't some random guy but instead an actual motorcycle mechanic-shop deal, so I'm hopeful that this one should work! As always though, I will make sure to test it before doing anything else, and I have that other Ebay one coming in the mail so I can have that on hand as backup in case this other doesn't work!

Thanks for all the help, especially loudhvx for all the technical info you have me with the meter and measuring what not, if this other new pickup that I ordered turns out to be garbage I will be testing that Ebay one and get back to you on values I get. But hopefully it won't come that far, thanks again!