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Black Plugs. Jetting should be good... any info?
- munkybrain2010
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20 Mar 2012 16:44 #510872
by munkybrain2010
Keep it together man!
79 KZ650 "Geto Cycle"
Black Plugs. Jetting should be good... any info? was created by munkybrain2010
Ok so I have a 79 kz650 C I live in Missouri and it has straight pipes and open intake. I have ~115 main jet and 17.5 pilot jet with the needle clip one clip up (richer). It has stock coils and I redid the whole wiring harness and I am barely losing any Voltage at the coil, if any. Its a still got the points.
It rides and starts pretty well for kick only. I have smooth accel, no pop on decel and pretty smooth transition, from what Ive heard and felt it may need to even go a bit richer on the main.
HOWEVER. All the plugs are sooty and black?? This just doesnt sound right to me for a bike with such an open air system?? Im fairly sure my jetting isnt too far off.
Im assuming its electrical but I was wondering if you guys had any insight as to whether its timing crappy coils valves or whatever??
Thanks Its getting too warm to not be riding!
It rides and starts pretty well for kick only. I have smooth accel, no pop on decel and pretty smooth transition, from what Ive heard and felt it may need to even go a bit richer on the main.
HOWEVER. All the plugs are sooty and black?? This just doesnt sound right to me for a bike with such an open air system?? Im fairly sure my jetting isnt too far off.
Im assuming its electrical but I was wondering if you guys had any insight as to whether its timing crappy coils valves or whatever??
Thanks Its getting too warm to not be riding!
Keep it together man!
79 KZ650 "Geto Cycle"
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- MFolks
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20 Mar 2012 17:34 #510876
by MFolks
1982 GPZ1100 B2
General Dynamics/Convair 1983-1993
GLCM BGM-109 Tomahawk, AGM-129A Advanced Cruise Missile (ACM)
Replied by MFolks on topic Black Plugs. Jetting should be good... any info?
Fresh plugs? proper heat range? Tried another brand of sparkplug? Checked the sparkplug caps? They have a 5000 ohm resistor inside that can fail over time.
Before tearing into the carbs, check for dirty air filter and low input voltage to the ignition coils:
Testing Kawasaki Ignition Coils For Input Voltage
When voltage testing Kawasaki Ignition Coils, the following needs to be done:
1. Remove the fuel/gas tank to access the coils.
2. Fully charge the battery.
3. Using a multimeter, set it up for VDC(Volts, Direct Current), range of 20.
4. Turn on the ignition switch and the run/stop switch to “Run”.
5. Put the multimeter’s RED probe on where the red or red/yellow wire goes on the ignition coil.
6. Put the multimeter’s BLACK probe on either the battery Negative(-) post/terminal or a good frame ground.
7. You should be able to see battery voltage at the ignition coil connection, but this depends on the current draw of other items in the same circuit.
8. If the tested voltage is down to 8-9 volts, you probably need to clean the many and various electrical connectors.
Cleaning Motorcycle Electrics
Get some of the De-Oxit electrical contact cleaner and figure on spending a good day going from the front of the bike to the back. It’s a plastic safe cleaner/preservative. www.deoxit.com is their website. Or use any plastic safe electrical contact cleaner(NOT WD-40 !).
On the older Kawasaki's, a majority of electrical connectors are inside the headlight housing requiring removal of the headlight, then the fun begins.
Do one set of electrical connectors at a time to avoid mixing up what connects to where. Usually disconnecting, spraying with De-Oxit and reconnecting is about all you'll need.
However, when encountering the green crud of corrosion, a brass wire brush may be needed on the pins you can reach.
Some 400-600 grit wet and dry sandpaper strips rolled into a tube should reach the male and female pins in the more difficult to clean connectors.
Smoker’s pipe cleaners, cotton swabs and wooden toothpicks work as cleaning aids.
Really small electrical connectors may require the use of a welders tip cleaning tool assortment.
Most pins in the connectors are coated with a thin plating of tin, and others may be nothing more than copper or brass.
If moisture is added, the resulting corrosion lowers the voltage/current being carried causing dim lights, slow engine cranking, slow turn signal responce and lower input voltage to the ignition coils resulting in weak spark.
The left and right handlebar switch pods will need attention too as they have circuit functions like turn, horn, run/stop, and start. The older Kawasaki’s have reports of the soldered connections crumbling, if your bike has this problem, just ask, as I’ve got a repair procedure for this.
Usually a spritz or two with actuation of the switch is about all needed for these switches unless corrosion is detected and then careful disassembly is required.
The ignition switch may or may be not sealed to allow spraying the internal contacts. I urge caution if attempting to open this up as springs, and ball bearings may fly out never to be seen again!
If your bike has the older style glass tubed fuses, I suggest replacing them as vibration can cause internal failure. AGX is the type used, and most auto parts stores can get them for you.
Clean the fuse holder clips, looking for signs of overheating(discolored insulation, signs of melting).
I use metal polish on a cotton swab, followed by spraying another clean swab with the De-Oxit and then rubbing the inside of the fuse clip.
All battery cables must be clean and tight for maximum current transfer. Check the cables going from the Negative(-) battery terminal/post to the engine mounting bolt
Also the one going from the Positive(+) terminal to the starter solenoid and from there to the starter motor.
If any battery cable feels ”Crunchy” when flexed, replace it as possible corrosion is inside the insulation.
Each "Bullet Connector" will have to be sprayed to ensure good connectivity, especially the ones going to the energizing coil of the starter solenoid.
The alternator output “Bullet Connectors” are usually behind the engine sprocket cover and will need inspecting and cleaning too.
The turn signal light sockets will benefit from a spritz from the contact cleaner along with the tail light/brake light socket.
Some brake light switches can be sprayed on the actuating rod, with the spray running down inside to the electrical contacts, others may be sealed requiring replacement if the switch is intermittent in operation.
Some people put the Di-Electric Grease on cleaned terminations/connectors, I don’t, as I’ve read/heard it can cause problems when it gets hot, actually insulating the connections, so the choice is yours to use or not.
I think I've covered about all of the electrical systems on the bike.........
“I spent a weekend going through every electrical connection and switch on the bike with a little scotchbrite pad and DeOxit - what a difference! Everything was brighter, gauge backlights, indicator lights, turn signals, I was getting a nicer spark, it fired up quicker, etc. Well worth my time. WELL worth it! “
From a forum member at www.kzrider.com
Before tearing into the carbs, check for dirty air filter and low input voltage to the ignition coils:
Testing Kawasaki Ignition Coils For Input Voltage
When voltage testing Kawasaki Ignition Coils, the following needs to be done:
1. Remove the fuel/gas tank to access the coils.
2. Fully charge the battery.
3. Using a multimeter, set it up for VDC(Volts, Direct Current), range of 20.
4. Turn on the ignition switch and the run/stop switch to “Run”.
5. Put the multimeter’s RED probe on where the red or red/yellow wire goes on the ignition coil.
6. Put the multimeter’s BLACK probe on either the battery Negative(-) post/terminal or a good frame ground.
7. You should be able to see battery voltage at the ignition coil connection, but this depends on the current draw of other items in the same circuit.
8. If the tested voltage is down to 8-9 volts, you probably need to clean the many and various electrical connectors.
Cleaning Motorcycle Electrics
Get some of the De-Oxit electrical contact cleaner and figure on spending a good day going from the front of the bike to the back. It’s a plastic safe cleaner/preservative. www.deoxit.com is their website. Or use any plastic safe electrical contact cleaner(NOT WD-40 !).
On the older Kawasaki's, a majority of electrical connectors are inside the headlight housing requiring removal of the headlight, then the fun begins.
Do one set of electrical connectors at a time to avoid mixing up what connects to where. Usually disconnecting, spraying with De-Oxit and reconnecting is about all you'll need.
However, when encountering the green crud of corrosion, a brass wire brush may be needed on the pins you can reach.
Some 400-600 grit wet and dry sandpaper strips rolled into a tube should reach the male and female pins in the more difficult to clean connectors.
Smoker’s pipe cleaners, cotton swabs and wooden toothpicks work as cleaning aids.
Really small electrical connectors may require the use of a welders tip cleaning tool assortment.
Most pins in the connectors are coated with a thin plating of tin, and others may be nothing more than copper or brass.
If moisture is added, the resulting corrosion lowers the voltage/current being carried causing dim lights, slow engine cranking, slow turn signal responce and lower input voltage to the ignition coils resulting in weak spark.
The left and right handlebar switch pods will need attention too as they have circuit functions like turn, horn, run/stop, and start. The older Kawasaki’s have reports of the soldered connections crumbling, if your bike has this problem, just ask, as I’ve got a repair procedure for this.
Usually a spritz or two with actuation of the switch is about all needed for these switches unless corrosion is detected and then careful disassembly is required.
The ignition switch may or may be not sealed to allow spraying the internal contacts. I urge caution if attempting to open this up as springs, and ball bearings may fly out never to be seen again!
If your bike has the older style glass tubed fuses, I suggest replacing them as vibration can cause internal failure. AGX is the type used, and most auto parts stores can get them for you.
Clean the fuse holder clips, looking for signs of overheating(discolored insulation, signs of melting).
I use metal polish on a cotton swab, followed by spraying another clean swab with the De-Oxit and then rubbing the inside of the fuse clip.
All battery cables must be clean and tight for maximum current transfer. Check the cables going from the Negative(-) battery terminal/post to the engine mounting bolt
Also the one going from the Positive(+) terminal to the starter solenoid and from there to the starter motor.
If any battery cable feels ”Crunchy” when flexed, replace it as possible corrosion is inside the insulation.
Each "Bullet Connector" will have to be sprayed to ensure good connectivity, especially the ones going to the energizing coil of the starter solenoid.
The alternator output “Bullet Connectors” are usually behind the engine sprocket cover and will need inspecting and cleaning too.
The turn signal light sockets will benefit from a spritz from the contact cleaner along with the tail light/brake light socket.
Some brake light switches can be sprayed on the actuating rod, with the spray running down inside to the electrical contacts, others may be sealed requiring replacement if the switch is intermittent in operation.
Some people put the Di-Electric Grease on cleaned terminations/connectors, I don’t, as I’ve read/heard it can cause problems when it gets hot, actually insulating the connections, so the choice is yours to use or not.
I think I've covered about all of the electrical systems on the bike.........
“I spent a weekend going through every electrical connection and switch on the bike with a little scotchbrite pad and DeOxit - what a difference! Everything was brighter, gauge backlights, indicator lights, turn signals, I was getting a nicer spark, it fired up quicker, etc. Well worth my time. WELL worth it! “
From a forum member at www.kzrider.com
1982 GPZ1100 B2
General Dynamics/Convair 1983-1993
GLCM BGM-109 Tomahawk, AGM-129A Advanced Cruise Missile (ACM)
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- Patton
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- KZr Legend
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20 Mar 2012 18:23 #510885
by Patton
Fat blue spark;
Valve clearances;
Clear tube test.
Good Fortune!
1973 Z1
KZ900 LTD
Replied by Patton on topic Black Plugs. Jetting should be good... any info?
Fat blue spark;
Valve clearances;
Clear tube test.
Good Fortune!
1973 Z1
KZ900 LTD
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- gd4now
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- Denco where did you go?
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20 Mar 2012 19:05 #510897
by gd4now
1977 KZ650 B1
Pods and Denco header
OLD KAW OWNERS SMILE ALOT
Replied by gd4now on topic Black Plugs. Jetting should be good... any info?
If there is proper voltage to the coils and a fat blue spark - then the black plugs are not due to an elec issue.
IIRC the carbs that were stock on a 79 C3 have an accel pump, 97.5 main and 15 pilot, an AO-5 needle jet and a 5CL16 jet needle set on the 3rd slot.
I would suggest as a good starting point for the intake and exhaust changes you have made to be main 110, pilot 17.5, jet needle set to the 4th slot.
IIRC the carbs that were stock on a 79 C3 have an accel pump, 97.5 main and 15 pilot, an AO-5 needle jet and a 5CL16 jet needle set on the 3rd slot.
I would suggest as a good starting point for the intake and exhaust changes you have made to be main 110, pilot 17.5, jet needle set to the 4th slot.
1977 KZ650 B1
Pods and Denco header
OLD KAW OWNERS SMILE ALOT
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- jonnybravo
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20 Mar 2012 20:26 #510906
by jonnybravo
Replied by jonnybravo on topic Black Plugs. Jetting should be good... any info?
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- munkybrain2010
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20 Mar 2012 23:33 #510955
by munkybrain2010
Keep it together man!
79 KZ650 "Geto Cycle"
Replied by munkybrain2010 on topic Black Plugs. Jetting should be good... any info?
Would old valve clearances make a bike run rich or mess up exhaust? My spark is flat and blue with NGK b7's. I think I will order some 110 mains and a some new plugs and see what happens. What about timing? Ive taken the points plate off and put it back where the screw marks were, I think I will try to clean the points as well.
Thanks guys
Thanks guys
Keep it together man!
79 KZ650 "Geto Cycle"
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- bountyhunter
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21 Mar 2012 01:53 #510988
by bountyhunter
I know the 750 twins run the B6ES.
1979 KZ-750 Twin
Replied by bountyhunter on topic Black Plugs. Jetting should be good... any info?
I thought the 650 ran the NGK B8?munkybrain2010 wrote: Would old valve clearances make a bike run rich or mess up exhaust? My spark is flat and blue with NGK b7's.
I know the 750 twins run the B6ES.
1979 KZ-750 Twin
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- Old Man Rock
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21 Mar 2012 07:40 #511001
by Old Man Rock
1976 KZ900-A4
MTC 1075cc.
Camshafts: Kawi GPZ-1100 .375 lift
Head: P&P via Larry Cavanaugh
ZX636 suspension
MIKUNI, RS-34'S...
Kerker 4-1, 1.5" comp baffle.
Dyna-S E.I.
Earls 10 row Oil Cooler
Acewell 2802 Series Speedo/Tach
Innovate LC1 Wideband 02 AFR meter
Phoenix, Az
Replied by Old Man Rock on topic Black Plugs. Jetting should be good... any info?
1976 KZ900-A4
MTC 1075cc.
Camshafts: Kawi GPZ-1100 .375 lift
Head: P&P via Larry Cavanaugh
ZX636 suspension
MIKUNI, RS-34'S...
Kerker 4-1, 1.5" comp baffle.
Dyna-S E.I.
Earls 10 row Oil Cooler
Acewell 2802 Series Speedo/Tach
Innovate LC1 Wideband 02 AFR meter
Phoenix, Az
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.