84 zn700 no spark

i'm just jumping the starter kinda like "hot-wiring it" using the 2 middle wires on the connecter because i think the "start" switch is bad are there wires i need to jump for the ignition too? thanks!

OR what do i need to do to make the bike run without using the "start" button?

Post edited by: scirocco17, at: 2006/05/18 23:00

If your bike turns over when you jump the starter solenoid, it still won't run because you need to power the coils as well. Rather than do all this jumpering, I suggest you just consider trying to fix the problem.

The jumper of the starter relay says your bike's battery works and most likely the charging system (making an assumption here that may not be correct but let's run with this for a bit).

OK... power (12VDC) comes from the charging system near the fuse box and runs THROUGH your ignition switch via the main wiring harness. You are bypassing the ignition switch when you jump the relay. FIRST step is to make sure the ignition switch works when you turn the key on if you want to do some trouble shooting properly as your lights and coils are SWITCHED VDC... that is, the power goes through this ignition switch and you will end up having to jerry-rig both coils and lights and horn and well... everything otherwise.

To check your ignition switch open your head light shell and find the connector that connects the ignition switch to the right hand switch gear. BUY A MULTIMETER!!! they are about $5 on sale at Harbor Freight but you can get one for a tad more at the hardware. A digital mutlimeter would be best if you are not electrically inclined.

OK... pull the connector apart (the one that connects ignition switch to right hand switchgear). Turn your key on and check for power using the multimeter. Put the POSITIVE lead on VDC scale (one of the lower settings). The Positive lead is red. Put the Negative lead (black) on a good frame ground which will be a bolt or bare metal. If you find 12VDC on several of the pins (not all will have 12VDC), then the ignition switch is likely good. Clean the connector terminals with contact cleaner and then put some dielectic grease on them. Both items can be had at ANY autoparts store.

Next thing to check is the right switchgear. Remove the two 5mm phillips head screws that hold the two halves together. Open it up and see where the wires come INTO the kill switch. Check for power there. You should have power if you had it at the connector. If you don't the wires are broken between the check point and connector. If you do, then make sure the kill switch is in the run position (YOU DID CHECK THAT THE KILL SWITCH WAS IN THE RUN POSITION BEFORE POSTING?). Check for power coming OUT of the kill switch. If there is not power, the kill switch is bad. This is common. If this is the case, get back and I will help you fix this problem (not a short answer). If the power is there, note there is a wire coming out of the kill switch and going to the start button. Since you have no power at the start button, you will likely have to power coming out the kill switch and going elsewhere either... this is likely the source of your problems.

If this is the case, trace the wire out to the connector that connects the switchgear to the main wire harness. OPEN UP this connector and with the key on, check for power on these pins. Find the pin connected to the wire coming off your kill switch. If you find power as you may, then the connector was loose or dirty. In any case, clean the terminals with contact cleaner and use some dielectic grease. This connector tends to loosen as it is generally on the steering neck and when the tank is removed, it tends to come loose. After cleaning, if these procedures fix the problem tape the connector with electric tape or use a wire tie to ensure it stays firmly connected.

The power is now coming back on the main harness and will feed the coils and go back to the fuse area to feed the electrical accessories on the bike (horn/turn signals and other stuff that requires the key on to work). I suggest the problem is most likely in the ignition switch or right switch gear or their connectors. Stop jumping stuff or you will likely end up frying something (probably yourself). Good luck!

The ign switch is good, well it's busted up a bit but still can be turned with a screwdriver and works as much as I need it to for now. I havent gotten to taking the right control off/apart which I am hoping is where my problem lies. It worked before I joined the Air Force (2 years Ago) But I just got the bike out of storage and in between then and now it fell off of a trailer once. That is probably the source of my start switch not working. The kickstand safety kill switch also used to have some problems as I recall, is there a way to permenantly disable/remove it? I installed it backwards because it used to stick after i raised the kickstand but I would just like to bypass it if possible. I'm going to go and take off/apart my right contril right now. Here I go!

Thanks!
-Dan

So I just went out and tested and traced some wires. i also took apart the right switch and cleaned it up all nice. This is what I came up with. Theres nothing wrong with the switch at all. I came to this conclusion after tracing the wires I had been jumping (Brown and Black)to get the starter to crank wich I thought was odd to begin with. Out of my selection of wires in the connector; Brown, Blue, Black, Red and Yellow/Red, the Brown and Blue run the hand brake light switch and I am assuming much like a cars ign that the Red = const+12v yellow = switched+12v and black is starter ground. I was Jumping the brown (brake const+12v to the black (starter ground) to make it crank. The wires inside the run switch are Black, Red, and Red/Yellow...makes sense. So the point is that I am getting NO power through the Red and Yellow/Red ign wires. Where does their power come from? Direct from the battery and/or the ign switch (key) which as far as I know works just fine. All f the lights work at least. Well, the ones that aren't broken but that wouldn't hinder the performance of the ignition wires at all. Also al of the fuses are good. So what now? How can I make power come from the red and yellow/red wires. I guess I have to find out where they come from first but I REALLY don't want to cut open the wire bundles and trace them. Is there an easier way??????

so does anyone knoe where the red and or yellow wires that go to the starter switch come from? or where i should start troubleshooting to find out why they have no power?

It sounds like you're running into the same problem I recently tackled on my ZN700.

It would only turn over intermittently using the starter button on the handlebar switch. Cleaning and lubing the contacts with dialectric grease only exacerbated the problem.
Replacing the entire right handelbar switch assy with a NOS one scored on eBay helped, but it still would act up once in a while...and usually while in bumper-to-bumper traffic! :blink:
It turns out that by wiggling the key in the ignition switch while in the ON position it would start and run.
And since the only thing that sounds out of the normal is your ignition switch (you stated it's busted up a bit, but works with a screwdriver), that leads me to believe that is where your problem is.

Unfortunately the ignition switch for our bike (part# 27005-5040) is kind of rare, and only lists as fitting the 84/85 ZN700 and the 84/85 ZN1100.
Not that isn't available anymore. But it's something you probably will have to obtain at a Kawi "stealership" since you'd be REALLY lucky to even find a decent functioning used one on eBay.

Now if your ignition switch is indeed in working condition, then the two other areas I'd suggest checking are the side stand switch (which you have already addressed it seems), and the starter lock-out switch at the clutch lever for problems.

The ignition switches in these bikes can be disassembled, and the contacts cleaned up and lubed. It is not that hard to do, but you need to be careful about not dropping any of the small inside bits onto the floor and having them roll under the other stuff laying around in the shop. I wrote something up about my experience in the old forum. Maybe we can find it in the archives.

YES! I FOUND IT: kzrider.com/forum/viewthread.php?tid=22644

Post edited by: apeman, at: 2006/05/21 18:28

Well, you didn't follow the steps I laid out for fixing the problem. The problem you are having honestly should only take about 1/2 hour to resolve unless something (such as the kill switch) needs to be disassembled and fixed. The yellow red wires are the wires that power your coils. The power on them starts at the fuse box area, goes through the ignition switch and kill switch and then back to the coils. Perhaps this would be one of the reasons I took the time to have you clean each of these components in order. Done in order and systematically, the problem is fixed... Good luck... OUT

OH MAN, YOU GUYS ROCK!!!! I cleaned the Ign switch really well and NOTHING. So I was bummed. I did notice that the black insert on the switch was up on one side about 1/2 mm more than the other so I held it together better and pushed the start button- BAM! fired right up like brand new. Idles weird though but theres no airbox so that might fix it. It sure was nice to hear her running again though. Thanks so much! I cant wait to get this project done. It's going to be my wifes bike and I'm planning on buying myself another bike after i finish my 79 Ramcharger project. Just got the motor for it 2 days ago and as soon as the heads get cleaned and the clutch gets here it's going in. It migght take longer than I thought at first though because I found a couple of extra exhaust mani's and a handful of chrysler 2.2 turbos. Yeah... a 318 twin turbo @ 7psi... should be able to scoot through the dirt a little better on those M/T 35's than n/a. Thanks again!!!

So I'm sitting here thinking that I don't want to take a screwdriver everywhere I go to start my bike, nor do I want to buy a new ign switch/lock assy. I was thinking about just assembling a switch panel with toggle switches. (I'm a B-52 mechanic I prettymuch have a limitless supply) That would replace the little black plastic round chunk which is the ign right now. It would also look kinda neet with the toggles and red guarded switches on the side maybe by the fuse box or opposite side. Not to mention those red guarded switched would go quite well with the flat black/white and red accents I am interested in doing. So what do you think? All I have to do is take a good look at the wiring to figure out what gets connected when you turn the key (screwdriver) ha.

Post edited by: scirocco17, at: 2006/05/22 13:21

If you can Google a wiring diagram or buy a shop manual I bet you can buy one of the dozens of ignition switches on ebay and make that work. I see Kaw ignition switches on ebay all the time. Good luck and have fun.

Here, I found one for you:
kz.mbsween.com/media/kz750l3-kz700.jpg

I would guess many different ign. switches will work, I'll check my cross reference software .

Part # = 27005-5040
Part Description = IGNITION SWITCH ASSEMBLY
Model Count = 8
Model Name Year Size Description Type
ZN700-A1 84 700 700 LTD SHAFT LTD STREET
ZN700-A1L 84 700 700 LTD SHAFT (CAL) LTD STREET
ZN700-A2 85 700 700 LTD SHAFT LTD STREET
ZN700-A2L 85 700 700 LTD SHAFT (CAL) LTD STREET
ZN1100-B1 84 1100 1100 LTD SHAFT LTD STREET
ZN1100-B1L 84 1100 1100 LTD SHAFT (CAL) LTD STREET
ZN1100-B2 85 1100 1100 LTD SHAFT LTD STREET
ZN1100-B2L 85 1100 1100 LTD SHAFT (CAL) LTD STREET
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Post edited by: OKC_Kent, at: 2006/06/01 14:03

thanks, i just took apart the ign switch today and started doing the toggle switch thing. i'm going to have to snake a couple more from work. it's going to take 4 switches to do the work of the original cylinder ign switch (this bike must be really hard to hotwire) but i am going to make a custom bracket for them, possibly mounted opposite the fuse box since theres space there. it'll feel more like an aircraft than a bike then. ha ha.