Ignition coils, weird problem 77'K650

Ok guys, here's one. I switched to a dynatek. No more points for me. Been great forever btw. I was missing on #1 after a while and figured my coils needed to go. So I bought some new ones from a reputable vendor and went to work. Here's where I screwed the pooch. I could swear on my mothers eyes that when I examined (w/o) thinking too hard about it, the coil arrangement, it had the old coils going from left side (plug 1&3) right side (plug 2&4). I can't believe I didn't think about it and away I went with trimming the coil lemngths (against the old) coil lengths and wired it up for 1&3 and 2&4. Well geuss what, nothing happened. No spark, looked again, got the book out and saw that I had it wrong per the book. Got online and sure enough everyone says I'm wrong. Well, I swear to God that the old wiring was the way I first saw it. Anyways, I've got it wired correct like it says for a 77 650 C model. Here's the RUB. I needed to shorten and lengthen the coils after switching them back around to left side 2&3 right side 1&4. I shrink wrapped the connections as best I could, waterproofed them, double checked........nothing. I don't have a volt meter right now, but I think, the connections I had to make have lowered spark, and screwed my OHM resistance? When I made the new connections, I overlapped the wires about an inch for best connectivity.....well, it ran awesome before all this, good plugs, everything. Checked wiring over and over because of the dynatec upgrade and I'm sure its right. WTF, I'm an idiot for once, I'm an engineer too, which makes it worse. I've never had a problem fixing the bike in the past, and I do everything myself. HEEEEEEEELLLLLLLLLPPPPP!?

Hello, uncledirt, and WELCOME to KZr!

If dealing with a Dyna-S electronic ignition and old oem ignition coils with permanently attached non-removable spark plug wires, and one or more wires is too short for whatever reason, the ideal solution would be to replace the ignition coils with Dyna green 3 ohm coils and Dyna solid core spark plug wires (delivered with caps already built in), all available from Z1 Enterprises.

Where circumstances dictate using the same old coils with permanently built in spark plug wires (that are likely old hardened, cracked, voltage-leaking wires), Z1E also offers a plug wire splicer whereby a new plug wire may be attached to an old plug wire.

Good Fortune!

Well, thanks but......? 3ohms is not going to get it done, it seems you probably know a lot about what you are talking about, however you make me feel like I'm in a product placement movie while I thought I was watching an educational movie that would enlighten me.......ah Hollywood. Beyong going into money, reasons for what I purchased, or anything else. And at the risk of offending a sacred cow on this forum, I don't need a commercial, hopefully you could re-read what I wrote and offer what you think has transpired in my wiring question? I can returmn the coils I suppose, but I can't afford the best stuff, perhaps there is another way?

Patton is right The ignition requires matched coils (3 Ohm)

Here's what I got.

www.z1enterprises.com/detail.aspx?ID=4333

Per my manual, it calls for 4 ohms.....

Already been on Z1 and I can't return that specific item of course, is the manual wrong?

Thanks.

.

martin_csr wrote:

uncledirt wrote: ..... I switched to a dynatek. No more points for me. ...

uncledirt wrote: .... Per my manual, it calls for 4 ohms...

So, you installed an electronic ignition, correct? And the manual's spec is for the points ignition, correct?
You need to match the correct coils to the particular ignition system.

That's what I said.:dry:

.

Logical, however, for a year there was no problem with the original coils coupled with the new dynatek. Figured when the time came, and it did, I could see that replacing the coils with near identical coils wouldn't/shouldn't present a problem. Again, my dynatec works fine, my old coils worked fine, and per my manual, I had to assume those old coils were 4ohm. Did I make a mistake because of the manual, that's the question? I see that the "Dyna S Electronic Ignition 4 Cylinder KAW #DS21" is the 3ohm, but I grew up in a world where the manual is god. So, have I been fooled, and those old coils were 3ohm? That's most important here.

Thanks, trying to get the learning curve less steep as fast as possible.

4 ohm coils will work fine. They will get more dwell than stock so will perform better than the points setup. At lower RPMs, the higher inductance 4-ohm coils may even provide more spark energy, theoretically. The only time you want faster charging coils is at higher RPMs when the dwell time is very low.

But if, during the testing, you cranked over the motor with the spark plug wires disconnected, and didn't give them a path to spark, then you may have burned out the ignition, or caused the coils to short internally (an ohm check may not show a problem sinc ethe short will be a high-voltage one). It's about a 50/50 chance.

Thanks Loud, the ignition still turns over, I need a volt meter to check relay etc, but nothing has changed really while all this has gone on. I did take a coil with a plug connected and tried to get a spark from the bottom to the fins on the side of the engine. I got no spark and that was a brand new plug as well. What do you recommend as far as diagnostics for this problem, I don't want to change anything radically cause I know mr. murphy too well. It's possible there's a short somewhere, but I can't see where and how.

If you leave one plug wire of the coil unconnected, with no path for the spark to travel, it will prevent both ends from sparking. The path is coil-to-plug-to-motor-to-otherPlug-to-coil. If that path is opened, the spark will create it's own path (damaging the coil, or the wires), or the ignition will simply short out the output transistor.

The Dyna S should have instructions for testing the ignition without turning the crank (I think you just bring a magnet near the pickups). When all is hooked up, lay all plugs on the motor and check for spark. If there's no spark, and the test was done properly, you will need a new coil or new DYna S.

Patton probably has more details on the procedure.