Installing wideband o2 sensor

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17 Jul 2009 16:49 #307640 by loudhvx
Replied by loudhvx on topic Installing wideband o2 sensor
I should mention, this is the bike I use in cold weather so I wouldn't be surprised if it comes in a little on the rich side, especially when hot.

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17 Jul 2009 17:21 #307646 by MFolks
Replied by MFolks on topic Installing wideband o2 sensor
If the header bolts snap (and I believe they are M8 X 1.25 X45)I have two websites for metric studs:

1. www.summitracing.com/parts/ARP-400-8023/?image=large (pricey, but ARP makes almost unbreakable studs)
2. www.rocketindustries.com.au/search.php?f...=ACCESSORY+STUD+KITS

1982 GPZ1100 B2
General Dynamics/Convair 1983-1993
GLCM BGM-109 Tomahawk, AGM-129A Advanced Cruise Missile (ACM)

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17 Jul 2009 17:28 #307650 by loudhvx
Replied by loudhvx on topic Installing wideband o2 sensor
Thanks Mfolks. Actually, this motor is probably going to be a throwaway. It has compression that's too high (over 200 psi). I think someone shaved the head. It also leaks a lot of oil. The trans is clunky and when it's real hot, I hear some rod knock down low when it starts.

I've been waiting for the motor to blow up so I can replace it with one of my spares, but it just keeps going, and rips too!

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17 Jul 2009 18:03 #307662 by MFolks
Replied by MFolks on topic Installing wideband o2 sensor
Kind of like the Ever ready Bunny! Keeps going,and going.......

1982 GPZ1100 B2
General Dynamics/Convair 1983-1993
GLCM BGM-109 Tomahawk, AGM-129A Advanced Cruise Missile (ACM)

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17 Jul 2009 19:41 #307686 by loudhvx
Replied by loudhvx on topic Installing wideband o2 sensor
Yeah, I've been waiting 9 years so far.

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  • TeK9iNe
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17 Jul 2009 22:27 #307723 by TeK9iNe
Replied by TeK9iNe on topic Installing wideband o2 sensor
:laugh: i love the setup,

Brilliant! :P

Motorcycle Shop Owner/Operator

79 Kawie Z1000 LTD
81 Kawie Z1000 CSR
83 Honda VT750C A
85 Kawie GPZ900 A2
86 Zukie GS1150 EG
93 Yamie XV1100 E
Lucky to have rolled many old bikes through my doors ;)

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18 Jul 2009 01:33 #307761 by loudhvx
Replied by loudhvx on topic Installing wideband o2 sensor
Well, was able to get some seat time before the rain chased me off the highway.

At first I thought there may have been a wiring issue because the AFR was registering large swings. It could go from 11 or 12 up to 16 or even 18 for brief moments. The needle is servo driven so it is mostly immune to vibration and needle momentum. The swinging was definitely controlled, so I thought maybe there was a voltage issue or loose wire issue. I quickly ruled that out when I realized the movements were not random. They definitely coincided with throttle/RPM/load issues. After some time in the saddle I realized certain relationships that make sense, actually when you think about it.

Some generalizations:
As the throttle is opened, the AFR swings richer.
As the throttle is closed, the AFR swings leaner.
If the throttle is reduced, then held steady, making RPMs go down, such as coasting to a stop, the AFR goes lean.
If the throttle is opened, then held steady, making RPMs increase, AFR goes rich.
If the engine is turning faster than the throttle can sustain, the mixture will be leaner than if cruising steady at the same throttle position, and will get richer as the engine slows to a cruise.
If the engine is turning slower than the throttle can sustain, the mixture will be richer than if cruising steady at the same throttle position, and will get leaner as the engine speeds up to a cruise.
Steady cruising, the AFR should eventually level off to some steady value, but the value can be anywhere from about 12 at higher speed cruising to 14.6 at lower speed cruising. It really depends on throttle position and the jetting of that particular throttle position. I.E. if the throttle is greater than 1/2 or so, the main jet is going to determine the AFR reading. If the throttle is in the 1/16 to 1/8, the pilot jet and/or the needle will determine the AFR reading.

These are just rough initial impressions, but they kinda make sense. For instance, if you let the throttle return fully, but you are decelerating in gear, the engine is turning much faster than it would at idle. This means, for a short time, it's breathing a lot more than it would at idle. Typically, if the engine is breathing more than what the jetting was set for, the AFR will appear lean. That's exactly what I saw on the gauge. This explains why bikes sometimes pop on deceleration if the exhaust is upgraded without a jetting change. They get very lean as they decelerate in gear with the throttle closed.

So I made some rough readings, first on the centerstand compared to my Heathkit EGA, then on the road.
EGA = Heathkit tailpipe EGA
WB = Innovate Wideband LC-1
Numbers are AFR values.

First the centerstand:
Outside air temp: Approx 60 to 65 deg F
Cloudy, overcast, occasional light rain.
Barometric pressure unknown.
At startup with choke: 14 on EGA, 15 on WB
After slight warm up and choke turned off: 13.5 on EGA, 14 on WB
After more warm up: 12 on EGA, 13 on WB
Steady REV at 4000 RPM no load 12 to 12.5 on EGA and WB
Quick blip to 6000 RPM: 11 on WB at throttle open, jump to 14 after throttle closed
Idle after engine and carbs very hot: 12 on WB

Bike allowed to cool down.

On the road:
Before the bike was fully warmed, but choke was off, in city driving the AFR would take excurcions to 16 and 18. This all with smooth running and no pops, and very small throttle openings and low speeds.
After Warm up:
Top gear, WOT, starting at 5000 RPM: 10.8 to 11.2 WB steady as the bike accelerated.
Top gear, ~1/8 throttle, cruising 4700 RPM, 60 MPH: 14.6 WB
Top gear, ~3/16 throttle, cruising 5500 RPM, 70MPH: 14 WB
Top gear, ~1/4 throttle, cruising 6000 RPM, 77MPH: 12.5 WB
Neutral, Throttle returned, idle: 12

I brought some paper with me and stopped periodically to make some notes. These numbers are very preliminary and will probably change.
I need to calibrate the Heathkit EGA and the Innovate LC-1, replace the air filter and fuel filter, and need to make some paint markings on the throttle. The throttle positions were almost impossible to determine, and are probably innacurate on this test. I'll put a dab of white paint on the grip.

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19 Jul 2009 11:36 #308040 by loudhvx
Replied by loudhvx on topic Installing wideband o2 sensor
I mounted a camera on the bike. I should have a video up soon.
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19 Jul 2009 11:37 #308043 by loudhvx
Replied by loudhvx on topic Installing wideband o2 sensor
Here's a closeup of the gauge.
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20 Jul 2009 09:41 - 17 Oct 2011 13:00 #308220 by loudhvx
Replied by loudhvx on topic Installing wideband o2 sensor
So the videos are up.
I had to chop it into 3 10 minute segments to get them on youtube. Also,the fricken camera kept locking up for some reason. It never did it before. Anyway, I had to keep stopping and turning the camera off and on to resume recording. I finally got one good stretch on the expressway.

EDIT: By the way, as is usually the case, Youtube causes the sound and video to be out of sync at times.



Last edit: 17 Oct 2011 13:00 by loudhvx.

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20 Jul 2009 09:52 - 20 Jul 2009 09:53 #308221 by loudhvx
Replied by loudhvx on topic Installing wideband o2 sensor
When I watch them on the players on this thread, they pause a lot. If I watch them directly from youtube, they seem to play smooth, or smoother. After clicking it to play, click it again to play in a new window.
Last edit: 20 Jul 2009 09:53 by loudhvx.

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20 Jul 2009 18:04 #308320 by kzr750r1
Replied by kzr750r1 on topic Installing wideband o2 sensor
:) The key dance and text commentary were awesome. Made me wonder what my "extra" key is doing when I roll down the freeway. Used to live outside of Palatine in the early 80s... Nice to see the skyline. :)

Luckily, I planned ahead and placed a bung in the Kerker before ceramic coating. With additional luck threads will be the same.

Thanks for the review.

KZ750R1 + 1991 ZR750 = KZR750R1
Better to be shot out of a cannon then squeezed through a tube. - HST

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