Compression significantly different between throttle open and closed…why?

  • gd4now
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17 Jun 2022 10:41 #868988 by gd4now
I would first attempt the compression test in the same way you did and see if you get the same results. Second I have another question,  is the F1 a US market bike with a vacuum petcock? If yes then I would check the petcock for a leak in the diaphragm as have read where this can lead to a leak into the #2 carb via the vacuum hose/port into the carb and cylinder creating a flooding so to speak into that cylinder which will keep it from firing correctly. 

1977 KZ650 B1
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17 Jun 2022 10:59 #868990 by jekyllman
Thanks everyone for the insights. I’ll try the wet compression test and see if that changed much. 

@gd4now I do have the vacuum petcock, although I bought a cheap aftermarket one recently. I will admit that I have to run it on prime or else it doesn’t get enough fuel for the 3 working cylinders…

1980 KZ650F1 - 10k miles (see photo)
1981 KZ305 CSR - 10k miles (didn't have the heart to customize this one, will stay original)

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17 Jun 2022 22:24 #869004 by ckahleer

......or/and maybe the synchronization is not great, and the butterfly of #2 is almost closed...with not throttle, related to the others.
I'm thinking the same thing, 

94 KE100
81 CM200t
82 KZ305
85 VF1100c

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18 Jun 2022 04:58 - 18 Jun 2022 04:59 #869006 by Warren3200gt
"Compression significanty different between throttle open and closed…why?" 
Same reason it's harder to breathe through a straw than it is through a drainpipe. 


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Last edit: 18 Jun 2022 04:59 by Warren3200gt.
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18 Jun 2022 06:41 #869010 by TexasKZ

Thanks everyone for the insights. I’ll try the wet compression test and see if that changed much. 

@gd4now I do have the vacuum petcock, although I bought a cheap aftermarket one recently. I will admit that I have to run it on prime or else it doesn’t get enough fuel for the 3 working cylinders…
Is the vacuum line from the petcock connected to the problem cylinder? Perhaps the diaphragm in the petcock is leaking badly.

1982 KZ1000 LTD parts donor
1981 KZ1000 LTD awaiting resurrection
2000 ZRX1100 not ridden enough

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18 Jun 2022 23:51 #869033 by jekyllman
Ok so I was about to do the wet test but I ended up with the following numbers, cold, throttle closed:

1: 135
2: 145
3: 140
4: 155

…so I figured things are good? 

I then thought that maybe I should double check carb vacuum balance. Vacuum was too low (~10cmHg) so I adjusted everything up to in spec. 

Still no fire in cylinder #2 and that’s while using an aux gas supply and the vacuum petcock port capped

I can’t figure this thing out

1980 KZ650F1 - 10k miles (see photo)
1981 KZ305 CSR - 10k miles (didn't have the heart to customize this one, will stay original)

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  • hardrockminer
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19 Jun 2022 04:57 #869040 by hardrockminer
You need three things for combustion....compression, spark and fuel.  If compression is OK, and I would use the standard test with the throttle open, then check for spark.  If you have spark then the problem is fuel.  

I have several restored bikes along with a 2006 Goldwing with a sidecar. My wife has a 2019 Suzuki DR 650 for on and off road.

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19 Jun 2022 09:26 #869052 by ckahleer
I have always heard that just because a plug sparks outside an engine. does not mean it is sparking inside, under compression.
What is the best way to tell if a plug is firing?

94 KE100
81 CM200t
82 KZ305
85 VF1100c

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19 Jun 2022 09:29 #869053 by Wookie58

I have always heard that just because a plug sparks outside an engine. does not mean it is sparking inside, under compression.
What is the best way to tell if a plug is firing?
Swop it with a good cylinder and see if the problem moves with it 

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19 Jun 2022 10:06 #869056 by jekyllman
^this I would like to know. I just switched out the ignition coil (and wires and caps) on that side hoping to resolve something. I have a hunch there still might be issues with the points/condensers 

1980 KZ650F1 - 10k miles (see photo)
1981 KZ305 CSR - 10k miles (didn't have the heart to customize this one, will stay original)

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19 Jun 2022 12:12 #869061 by TexasKZ

^this I would like to know. I just switched out the ignition coil (and wires and caps) on that side hoping to resolve something. I have a hunch there still might be issues with the points/condensers 
Are you absolutely sure the high tension leads are connected to the correct cylinders? One coil fires cylinders 1 & 4, while the other fires 2 & 3.

1982 KZ1000 LTD parts donor
1981 KZ1000 LTD awaiting resurrection
2000 ZRX1100 not ridden enough

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20 Jun 2022 20:26 - 20 Jun 2022 20:27 #869144 by jekyllman
Yeah that’s how it’s set up.

update: I’ve got 13.3V at the battery. Voltage at the ignition coil leads are both 11.7. Is that normal? That doesn’t explain why one cylinder isn’t firing but I thought they should be at or near battery voltage

edit: if both ignition coils are unplugged from their leads, they will read the correct voltage. I don’t understand why it would make a difference

1980 KZ650F1 - 10k miles (see photo)
1981 KZ305 CSR - 10k miles (didn't have the heart to customize this one, will stay original)
Last edit: 20 Jun 2022 20:27 by jekyllman.

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