Shim Sizes - Valve Clearances

Hello... Im still waiting on my manual from New Zealand (reprint) and I have just replaced all the gaskets in the top end...last night when I put the machine back together she ran but only if i gave it gas... had some chats with Del_Herring and 650Ed , and was was advised to check the valve clearances.

I took it apart, pulled the exisiting shims.. put the buckets back on and measured clearances. (there are no shims at all right now, this is clearance without shims, just buckets)

My results are as follows, and Im hoping someone can tell exactly what shim sizes I need in each. Thanks in advance. F being front, B being back where carbs connects

1F - .028/.711mm 2F - .025/.635mm 3F - .025/.635mm 4F - .026/.660mm
1B - .028/.711mm 2B - .028/.711mm 3B - .023/.584mm 4B - .025/.635mm

Subtract .10mm from your measurements, I would say. but I have never tried to measure with all shims removed. I don't know if there would be any difference doing it that way. I guess you'll find out.

Well I hate to sound dumb but here goes cause its going to be dumb... subtracting 10mm will do what exactly for me? I need to find out what shim I need ... Like in mm what shim...ie: f1 needs a 2.25mm shim to ,ake the required clearance etc etc

Dumb newbie here for sure...I admit that lol

thejij wrote: Hello... Im still waiting on my manual from New Zealand (reprint) and I have just replaced all the gaskets in the top end...last night when I put the machine back together she ran but only if i gave it gas... had some chats with Del_Herring and 650Ed , and was was advised to check the valve clearances.

I took it apart, pulled the exisiting shims.. put the buckets back on and measured clearances. (there are no shims at all right now, this is clearance without shims, just buckets)

My results are as follows, and Im hoping someone can tell exactly what shim sizes I need in each. Thanks in advance. F being front, B being back where carbs connects

1F - .028/.711mm 2F - .025/.635mm 3F - .025/.635mm 4F - .026/.660mm
1B - .028/.711mm 2B - .028/.711mm 3B - .023/.584mm 4B - .025/.635mm

I respectfully suggest you wait until you get the manual before you dig the hole any deeper. You should have measured the valve clearances BEFORE taking things apart. Had you done so you would now know what shims you need. As it stands now, you will be removing and installing the cams more than necessary and you may end up causing some serious damage by installing the cams without the instructions in the manual (such as valve timing, cam cap torque specs, etc.). These bikes are pretty tough, but they can be damaged. Doing things correctly in the correct order will save you time, money, and frustration. Ed

I got the torque specs etc, and I know how to time it with the in line level to the cylinder and the z7ex and counting 0 to 45 and the 46. And to have it at tdc etc when doing the cam chain up.

Its just the shim size I need ... yea I should have checked before....it was running fine, so I thought I would leave as is. When I went to get the covers cleaned buddy pulled the buckets etc a d messed it all up ... so iwasnt sure what went where anymore.

Thanks ed appreciate it

I noted the shims that I had installed, before the buckets got removed so after drawing it out on paper, i think I have what is the right calculations for valve clearance.

Im hoping this is correct... if I am out to lunch.. please let me know. It made sense to me when I was adding the .number(mm)+.shimihave(mm)= close to .08 for the acceptable clearance.

I have attached a picture of what I am talking about... and will recheck the math before installing and trying it out.

Hope Im on the right track.

In 40 years no one has ever attempted measuring clearance without shims, so if this procedure works it would be a major breakthrough, but by your measurements it doesn't work. For example if you are now measuring .700mm clearance on a valve and want to get close at .10mm you would have to fit a 60 shim? I don't think. The reason this does not work is the shim fits in a recess so now the bucket with no shim is not even contacting the valve stem where the shim rides. The only way to calculate correct shim is to measure your clearances and if they are too big (doubtful) then you add a larger shim. So if you measured .20mm and want to go to .10mm you would add a 2 size larger shim, so if a 250 was in there you would fit a 260 and remeasure. Now on the other hand if the normal happens you'll find valves are too tight or no measurable clearance, so in this case all you can do is take a calculated guess and fit a 2 or 3 size smaller shim then remeasure, or put in a several size too small, measure and calculate the correct shim from there.

The correct and only solution you have right now is to assemble the head placing all the shims in the order they cam out then do your measuring. You can then make an informed decision on what size shims you are going to need. I have done what you are trying to do once a long time ago and it does not work.

If the shims are to tight to measure, use this little trick i read about on here before. If you cant get a feeler guage in there and cant spin the bucket with your thumb drop two sizes and remeasure. If you cant get the feeler guage in and CAN spin the bucket with your thumb, drop one size and remeasure. Hope that helps.

Hah cool...I'll try that.

I was offered this little nugget on another forum....

Unfortunately you have to have shims installed to determine what shim is needed . The issue is that the bucket contacts the retainer before it touches the valve stem . There is no way to get it done the way you suggest . Having been in that mess with an assembled engine , in the frame I'll give you the best way out that I found .

Turn the engine 90 degrees past top dead center . This gets the pistons out of the way . It doesn't matter if it's 90 past 1-4 or 2-3 . Think about it ....

One camshaft at a time install all four buckets with your smallest shims . Record the clearances AND the installed shims in EACH . You will of course have to find another way other than the cam chain to turn the camshaft . Do not rotate the crankshaft .
Repeat for the other camshaft . This will tell you what is required for each individual valve . You will possibly need only a couple of shims .

I did all that...but just gotta figure out how to turn the camshaft now to measure. That bigger is right and hard to turn