1976 KZ400 S2

Hoping this is an easy fix. A few weeks ago I took apart the right side of the motor to correct an issue I had with the kick start lever (would not return due to an issue with the coil spring). This required me to complete disassemble everything under the clutch cover. so before filling it with oil, i put cover back on and went to give it a kick and noticed that the plates inside the clutch basket spins but the actual basket (which is connected via primary chain to a gear) does not spin.

It kind of feels like clutch plates are not engaging and therefore just spin inside the basket. I took it apart a second time but still got the same result.

any suggestions???

bighamms wrote:

Hoping this is an easy fix. A few weeks ago I took apart the right side of the motor to correct an issue I had with the kick start lever (would not return due to an issue with the coil spring). This required me to complete disassemble everything under the clutch cover. so before filling it with oil, i put cover back on and went to give it a kick and noticed that the plates inside the clutch basket spins but the actual basket (which is connected via primary chain to a gear) does not spin.

It kind of feels like clutch plates are not engaging and therefore just spin inside the basket. I took it apart a second time but still got the same result.

any suggestions???

Couple of questions please.

Does the electric starter seem to work okay?

Is clutch lever being (improperly) squeezed while using the kick starter?

Is bump start possible?
If so, does clutch then work normally?

Has routine clutch push rod adjustment been done?

Is a parts diagram being referenced for reassembly?

Good Fortune!

@Patton...thanks for the reply. I'll try to answer your questions.

1. My model does not include an electric start...kick only

2. Clutch lever is not being squeezed while kicking (although I've made that mistake a time or three)

3. I've not tried to bump start it. the bike is on a stand with the front end in pieces. So it may be a few days before I can try to bump start

4. Routine clutch push rod...I will need some explanation on this. I'm not sure how to do that. However, the clutch is completely assembled right now. So when i use the clutch lever, it does DISengage the clutch (pushing clutch pressure plate away from the clutch plates and baskets). When I let the lever go, the pressure plate and clutch plate contract back into the basket, but do not seem to ENgage or lock together. Which causes all the plates to just freely spin when i try to kick it)

5. Yes, I am using a manual. And as far as i can tell, I've reassemble it exactly as instructed. although, these are usually the times when you realize that you didn't do it exactly as instructed.

bighamms wrote:

...not tried to bump start it. the bike is on a stand with the front end in pieces. So it may be a few days before I can try to bump start

4. Routine clutch push rod...I will need some explanation on this. I'm not sure how to do that. However, the clutch is completely assembled right now. So when i use the clutch lever, it does DISengage the clutch (pushing clutch pressure plate away from the clutch plates and baskets). When I let the lever go, the pressure plate and clutch plate contract back into the basket, but do not seem to ENgage or lock together. Which causes all the plates to just freely spin when i try to kick it)....

not tried to bump start--- very understandable :lol:
Could try hand rotating rear wheel with transmission in gear to determine whether there's any clutch function. (That's what I was wondering about.)

(Am reviewing push rod adjustment for suspected similarity to large four.)

Good Fortune!

Patton wrote:

bighamms wrote:

...(Am reviewing push rod adjustment for suspected similarity to large four.)

Looks pretty close.
Should be an easily removable access plate on the engine sprocket cover to reach the adjuster screw and lock nut.

Clutch push rod adjustment -- Need and Purpose
[This is a 1 minute job from start to finish, maybe 2 minutes the first time.]

The FSM covering Z1 and KZ900 includes a periodic maintenance chart requiring clutch push rod adjustment at 2000 mile (3000 km) intervals and explains the need therefor in separate text, which explanation is quoted verbatim as follows:

Besides cable stretch, clutch plate wear also causes the clutch to go out of adjustment, with a decrease in push rod play. Due to this wear, the push rod gradually moves closer to the clutch release lever (at the lower end of the clutch cable) until it touches the adjusting screw. When the rod is touching the screw and therefore has no play, the clutch will not engage fully and clutch slippage will occur. Note that the clutch push rod does not necessaily have play just because the clutch hand lever has play, and so hand lever play alone cannot be used to determine whether or not the clutch requires adjustment.


The FSM covering '77-'79 KZ1000's includes a periodic maintenance chart requiring clutch adjustment at 5000 km intervals, and explains the need therefor in slightly different language, which explanation is quoted verbatim as follows:

Clutch plate wear also causes the clutch to go out of adjustment. This wear causes the play between the push rod and the adjusting screw to gradually diminish until the push rod touches the adjusting screw. When this play is lost, the clutch will not engage fully, causing the clutch to slip.
NOTE: Even though the proper amount of play exists at the clutch lever, clutch lever play alone cannot be used to determine whether or not the clutch requires adjustment.

---

end of excerpt

---

Would try this ---
Remove access plate;
Loosen lock nut;
Loosen adjuster screw (guessing counter clockwise);
Tighten screw (clockwise) until lightly seated;
Back off screw 1/4~1/2 turn (this provides the necessary gap);
Tighten lock nut;
Test clutch function;
Replace access cover.

Good Fortune!

bighamms wrote:

i put cover back on and went to give it a kick and noticed that the plates inside the clutch basket spins but the actual basket (which is connected via primary chain to a gear) does not spin.

I don't think the kick starter should be trying to turn the primary drive. It should only be kicking the engine and the clutch should be disngaging drive to the primary chain side of the clutch.

@bountyhunter...before I disassembled the bike to correct the kickstart issue (coil spring jumped out of kicker shaft hole) the bike was working properly. When I would kick the bike over, there would be plenty of resistance from the clutch (while bike is in neutral and clutch lever remains untouched). This would cause the engaged clutch to grab the entire basket and rotate it. Because the basket carries the primary chain, it would spin the chain which is connected to a gear (i forget the tech name for this gear). That gears would also spin which opens/closes the advance and sends signal to points telling it when to fire the coils and plugs. In its current state, when kicked, the plates are NOT engaging so they spin freely inside the backet. Because the basket is not turning it does not turn the gear and therefore the motor won't fire because of lack of spark. I hope this all makes sense. As mentioned, I am new to wrenching but learning quickly

@all... Sometimes life makes you laugh and cry and then laugh again. Quick update. So i took the clutch apart AGAIN. I saw a youtube video where the guy made a comment about the orientation of the metal plates that press against the pressure plates. These plates have a very very slight angle at the teeth. And the teeth should be pointing away from the bike. I would have never noticed that on my own. So i corrected all the plates and it engaged exactly as it should.....LAUGH.
Then i put the spring plate back on the basket and torqued it to spec. As I was torquing the last bolt, the head of the bolt complete spun off and bolt broke inside the spring shaft.....CRY
So, decided to drill out the bolt and attempt to get it out with an easy-out bit. As soon as I started to drill it to make room for the easy-out, the bolt began to spin. So i was able to just spin is out with the drill in reverse.....LAUGHING ONCE AGAIN

At this point, i'm going to replace the broken bolt, do the clutch adjustment, replace the cover and ride into the sunset.