cam chain idler gear and tensioner concerns

so this 1978 that i just got is my first KZ ever. i've been riding motocross for years and wanted a new project and a summer commuter so i got my new toy. it is in excellent shape but i'm going through the motor. i pulled the head off and laid everything out. then i start reading the reassembly and see these little rubber dampers on the 2 cam chain idler gears. i looked at the front ones and they were there, but my back ones are missing, i looked up under the head also and they weren't in the little slots. :ohmy: they are either swept outside, in my garbarge, or there is a good chance they fell into the case. i know i'm a newbie at the kz thing and i'm learning as i go. now i'm wondering how much damage do you think they will do if they are in the case? they are 100% rubber so what could it really do? i'm not to interested in splitting my case for a piece of rubber. my thinking is that it will probably get chewed up and work it's way into the oil filter i hope. any other views on that? and also, is the cam chain tensioner, the rubber wheel, suposed to have any teeth on it or is it supposed to be smooth? oh and what would you recommend for valve clearance between the cam and the bucket? and what torque for the head bolts and valve cover bolts? i'll probably have 10 more questions tomorrow. thanks

semper kz wrote:

so this 1978 that i just got is my first KZ ever. i've been riding motocross for years and wanted a new project and a summer commuter so i got my new toy. it is in excellent shape but i'm going through the motor. i pulled the head off and laid everything out. then i start reading the reassembly and see these little rubber dampers on the 2 cam chain idler gears. i looked at the front ones and they were there, but my back ones are missing, i looked up under the head also and they weren't in the little slots. :ohmy: they are either swept outside, in my garbarge, or there is a good chance they fell into the case. i know i'm a newbie at the kz thing and i'm learning as i go. now i'm wondering how much damage do you think they will do if they are in the case? they are 100% rubber so what could it really do? i'm not to interested in splitting my case for a piece of rubber. my thinking is that it will probably get chewed up and work it's way into the oil filter i hope. any other views on that? and also, is the cam chain tensioner, the rubber wheel, suposed to have any teeth on it or is it supposed to be smooth? oh and what would you recommend for valve clearance between the cam and the bucket? and what torque for the head bolts and valve cover bolts? i'll probably have 10 more questions tomorrow. thanks

You've got to get those out, or they'll do some damage. If you're lucky they fall right into the oil pan so you can remove that(engine still in the frame) and get them out. If not, they'll jam some gears, or get ground up and plug oil passages.

As for the timing parts, yes the rubber wheel is smooth. Search the forum for info about replacements and Liska parts.

As for the torque specs, its worth your tim e to get a shop manual.

Sam

Leaving parts loose in the engine is never advisable, however, I'll add my personal experiences, which were that I was also leary of splitting the cases to retrieve rubber. (Yes I have done the same thing). I elected to take my chances and just run the engine and it did no harm. Several thousand miles later, like 50,000 or more I had a leak at the oil pan, so dropped the pan and there were those rubber dampers just sitting in the bottom of the pan. I assume you mean those little rectangular wedges, not the 2" long ones up at the top tensioner. Of course those dropping in would have to be removed. Just my own idea, best to remove, but I'd bet highly against any harm by leaving them in there.

Why don't you pull the filter(drain all the oil first) and get in the oilpan that way,and fish around with a small mirror,and see if you can spot them.
OR,even just pull the pan and snoop around up in there for them,if you think they fell in.Use either silicone or a new gasket to put the pan back on.(I recommend a new gasket)

And yes,you SHOULD get a manual for all the specs.
The head nuts will be torqued to somewhere around 28 foot pounds,but DO...get a manual to be sure.

Those rubbers are dampners,and without them,those idler gears will move around,and you'll get wear and unwanted noise.

RonKZ650 wrote:

Leaving parts loose in the engine is never advisable, however, I'll add my personal experiences, which were that I was also leary of splitting the cases to retrieve rubber. (Yes I have done the same thing). I elected to take my chances and just run the engine and it did no harm. Several thousand miles later, like 50,000 or more I had a leak at the oil pan, so dropped the pan and there were those rubber dampers just sitting in the bottom of the pan. I assume you mean those little rectangular wedges, not the 2" long ones up at the top tensioner. Of course those dropping in would have to be removed. Just my own idea, best to remove, but I'd bet highly against any harm by leaving them in there.

You posted as I was posting,lol.

Any noise Ron?...without those rubbers?

i understand i need the new dampers, i already ordered them, and yes i mean the small rubber rectangles, not the big ones on the the top gear. i'm gonna drop the oil and the oil pan and take a look. thats as far as i'm going, if they're not in the pan i'm takin my chances. it's not that i'm leary about splitting the case, it's just way more work than i want to get into right now for a piece of rubber. mind you, if it was a nut, bolt, anything else that wasn't rubber, i would be splittling my cases. it's not that i'm lazy or don't care about my toys, it's just that it's not metal. thanks for the input everyone. and a shop manual is on my list for the week.

And if you don't see ang rubber parts,just spray a whack of WD40 in from the top-side of the engine,and maybe they'll get washed through.(if they're even IN there)

Just remember to grab your Wifes favorite bath towel(or robe),to soak up all the WD40,as you don't want that all over your garage floor,right?:laugh:

Best of luck with that!