YIKES. . .yes, it's kinda easy stuff

Starting on the starter clutch.
11-06-07

I thought this was going to be harder to do than it is.

I haven't even expletive deleted yet. Which means a lot.

Having the correct tools helps.

13 mm for footpegs, kickstarter lever, and rear master cylinder. Don't have to take off the brake pedal.
14 mm for muffler hangers and oil / filter drain.
10 mm for shifter lever, muffler headers, and oil pan. I discovered that if I use a 1/4" drive socket setup with extensions, I can get to all of the header nuts without taking the fairing bracket loose.
#2 phillips impact bit for all screws.
3/8" drive impact driver.
24oz hammer for impact driver.
Block of wood to pound with hammer against clutch cover to loosen.
12 mm for clutch pack spring bolts.
30 mm socket and impact wrench (I used electric) for clutch hub.
Once you pull the nut off the end of the shaft, you can pull the entire clutch pack off as an assembly. I didn't, but you can. Nearly lost the ball bearing when it came out unannounced with the pusher plate. No clutch engagement upon reassembly would have been a real problem.

Circlip pliers, needed only if starter dampners are to be serviced. I inspected mine, but at 50k miles, they were fine.

Only one screw stripped, the lower of the bearing cap cover screws. I didn't have the impact driver centered. Everything else came out with the 24oz whack attack. It was a little oxidized on the threads too. I'm relieved it's apart. I had the Vise-grips in the wings had they become necessary. Might go back wiith stainless allen bolts everywhere. Got to love those advances in technology and metallurgy.

The secondary shaft came out in three parts. I tried to pull on the whole thing and the HY-VO chain was still wrapped around the gear, so that part didn't stay with the rest of the shaft when I pulled some on it.

Once the shaft was out, the clutch drive gear kind of plopped out on it's own. Which left the HY-VO chain holding the clutch itself.

I did this thing on the sidestand. Lots easier than pulling an engine first. Loose motors are heavy and clumsy. I'm a wimp. Plus I value my fingers a lot. I hate crush risk. Only time I had to lean the bike the other way was to clobber the bearing cap screws. In retrospect, I could have left the bike alone and leaned me over a wee bit more instead.

In looking at the clutch, I was suprised it worked at all. It did, occasionally, once the motor was warm. Only one of the rollers still had spring pressure. Because only one roller had an entire spring working the plunger. Trying to start a points-driven bike after a hard rain has humidity soaked them eventually exacts a toll. A Dyna upgrade early on might have prevented this rebuild.

Look what I found in the pan.



I think its what was left of my tensioner after it disintegrated while I was riding about four years ago. I replaced what I found was broken at the time, but I never did find the pesky roller. Until last night I think it finally migrated.


11-07-07

Tonight I scraped gaskets off cases. No shortcuts here. The hardest part of the job so far. Laying flat on my back, scraping the bottom of the crankcase, looking up as bitty pieces of gasket residue float gracefully down into my eyes. The right assortment of scrapers help in this adventure.

11-08-07

Today my wallet is $52.00 lighter. Kind of makes me sorry I didn't buy the entire 0 mile factory training engine for $50.00 from the local E-bayer "pick-up only" when I had the chance. But crush risk is as real now as it was a couple minutes ago. I'll probably see comments about how I could have had a V-8 with Jeff. When I walked into the dealer, I had the hope that he would have the parts sitting on the shelf, so I would have the bike back together in time for weekend riding. Once the parts guy assembled my needs list I kind of felt like it would have been wrong to walk out on him just to have to wait for parts anyway. If I had known what I needed going in, I guess I could have had some of this stuff here already.

Parts breakdown:

1 Gasket, Clutch cover $15.20
p/n 11009-1984
3 Spring $ 7.95
p/n 92081-110
3 "O" ring $11.01
p/n 92055-077
1 Gasket, Oil pan $15.86
p/n 11009-1983

I guess I could have cut my own gaskets. Or used gray RTV, like I did to seal the pan when the thing was off last time, 4 years ago. Apparently the 90mm "O" ring that seals the top of the oil pan where the filter resides is the same "O" ring that is used to seal the oil filter cover. I have an extra one of those laying around, so that saves me about $6.00. Thanks, helpful Kawasaki parts guy.

I might have to service things under the covers in the future, so any information regarding gasket preservation would be really helpful by the time I need to reassemble this engine.

The last time I priced out the roller kit, it was around $30.00, so it would have been silly to have bought that, since I only needed $8.00 worth of springs.

More to come as I attempt to complete this project.

Post edited by: KaZooCruiser, at: 2007/11/13 17:54

Nice write up. Can't wait to hear how it all turns out!

loudhvx wrote:

Nice write up. Can't wait to hear how it all turns out!

I second both of those thoughts.

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Have to make a correction to the above:
Oil plug / Filter is 17mm, not 14.
Clutch pack bolts are 10 mm, not 12.

11-13-07
All my parts are in, so I think I'll finish it tonight. One can hope.
A mechanic with some experience tells me that Permatex makes a product called High Tack.
Supposed to be good for keeping gaskets pliable. So I need to get some of that. Need some plastic emblem adhesive for the other side of the gasket, to keep it against the covers. Ended up with Duco plastic adhesive. A gallon of oil, and a can of brake cleaner. $15.86.

I got the gaskets glued to the covers. In three hours, what else did I accomplish?

I reassembled the springs, plungers, rollers, and starter clutch. Coated everything with fresh oil
as I put things together. Got the secondary shaft reinstalled, once I realized that it could probably
go back into place in two subassemblies, according to Factory Service Manual picture, but I ened
up reinstalling it the same way it came out of the case. Hang the clutch on the Hy-Vo chain, with
the washer inside where the clutch rollers are. The oil will keep it stuck to the clutch. Then
install the starter drive gear, then feed the secondary shaft in from the clutch side, adding the
other washer before inserting into starter drive gear. Once I had all the pieces located on the
secondary shaft, it was an easy lift to center the shaft in the bearing on the left side of the engine.
Hardest part of the puzzle was getting the starter drive gear to seat inside the clutch, now that
three spring-loaded rollers were blocking unimpaired entrance. This thing is still pretty much a
ho-hum proceedure.

Used white engine assembly grease to prime the oil pump. FSM says to use oil, but who knows
how long the oil pump might stay out of an oil filled resevoir. Got it installed.

Have to remember to reinstall the stopper plate prior to inserting the secondary shaft all the way,
Used red Loctite on both the starter clutch allen bolts, and the stopper plate screws. I trust that
stuff more than staking screw heads.

11-14-07

Lunch today was spent getting metric stainless steel allen bolts at a local distributor.

15 for the oil pan.
2 for the bearing cover
10 for the clutch cover

Tonight I deglazed the clutch fiber discs, and got the clutch back together. Anyone besides me
re-use the clutch hub nut?

11-15-07

Got the oil pan into place, clutch cover, bearing cover and sprocket cover reinstalled, with fresh
oil and filter. Pulled the sparkplugs and went to pull the clutch lever in order to spin over the
motor to test the work / circulate the new oil

At least I was home when the clutch cable broke. Lucky coincidence I guess.

I was still able to pull in the lever so I could crank the motor. I had starter clutch interaction for about 3 minutes, in 5 second increments. Long enough to get the oil pressure high enough to get
the light to go out.

Then the starter clutch started chattering on application.

It's worse now than it was before I did anything to try to repair it.

And I don't know why.

KaZooCruiser wrote:

11-07-07

Tonight I scraped gaskets off cases. No shortcuts here. The hardest part of the job so far. Laying flat on my back, scraping the bottom of the crankcase, looking up as bitty pieces of gasket residue float gracefully down into my eyes. The right assortment of scrapers help in this adventure.



I COMPLETELY agree with that. definately the worst part of doing the whole thing right there. trying to get those liiiiiittle stuck pieces of gasket off upside down and oily. goodluck!!! stick with it, we'll get it straightened out!

Post edited by: freebyrd24, at: 2007/11/19 08:56

KaZooCruiser wrote:

---

....At least I was home when the clutch cable broke. Lucky coincidence I guess...

....Then the starter clutch started chattering on application.

It's worse now than it was before I did anything to try to repair it.

And I don't know why.

WOW Kazoo; those both suck.
BTW...
Got my scooter going last weekend but wanted to test it out a little more B4 letting you know.
I had forgotten how scary this thing is when you crank it to WOT. Still cutting out some, but I am on the right track. Actually let the little lady on it for the first time. Would not let her go till now as I did not want her to have to walk back.
I have put 70 miles on it in three short rides, with no fouled plugs.
Want to putz around a little over the weekend?
E me.

. . .I wonder if I should have gotten the roller kit. . .

Sometimes it engages, and sometimes it just squalls as a testimony to a failed repair effort.

Any ideas on maybe the rollers have flatspots or some other defect?

At least the kickstarter works.

I really don't like to have to find neutral to restart though.

And last Sunday, when I had a fouled plug, well that wasn't too much fun trying to kick over, either.

I did have an odd moment of clarity when I realized that the junk fouled plug that I slung into the woods in my frustration still had the screw cap that I needed for the plug I wanted to install.

Glad I found an extra one.

I think I feel like Calvin did when the propellor beenie just didn't work like he had hoped it would.

During the last couple days, in retrospect, I have realized that:

the clutch works better now that the plates are deglazed. . .

the stainless allen bolts are easier to work with than the mushy panhead screws will ever be. . .

The torque for those (6mm) is what the oil pan bolts are supposed to be at . . . 78 INCH pounds. . .

If I have to go back into this thing, it shouldn't be as involved. Maybe when the oil needs to be changed.

Keep an eye on the weather, Jim. It was nice today, at 75, but things could change later this week.

Hope y'all enjoy Thanksgiving.

Thanks Bud.
Jim@MilkyWay

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Hi, when you mention the problem, I.E. the starter catches for a sec then squals, do you mean that it turns the engine over like 1/2 to 1 turn then the starter just winds out???

That's the problem I'm experiencing....

alltimeqb wrote:

Hi, when you mention the problem, I.E. the starter catches for a sec then squals, do you mean that it turns the engine over like 1/2 to 1 turn then the starter just winds out???

That's the problem I'm experiencing....

Are you sure the rotor isn't just spinning on the crank?

Not sure what you mean... I have an 85 zn700 which just started to act up like Kazoo said his was.

The starter gear only spins one way but when I try to start the bike, the starter catches a bit but then spins without turning the bike over.

YeHaw, y'all. . .

After a long hiatus, i's back.

:woohoo:

Wasn't time for an oil change, but I got tired of having to find neutral to get the iron pony to wake up. . .

So!

I rolled the beastie into the basement, and dug in.

The first issue so far was the clutch side cover gasket was now permanently glued to the engine case, due to the use of Permatex sealant. . .note to self. . .NEVER use Permatex on engine side of gasket. . .

Course, the propane torch kind of made short work of the paper gasket and permatex aggravation, permanently.

Next issue to deal with. . .

getting the red loctited screws out. . .

second not to self. . .

NEVER use red Loctite on long mushy headed countersunk screws used to secure oil pump.

I discovered why metal sleves inside an aluminum case is a really good idea, since I destroyed one of them while drilling out a long, mushy decapitated countersunk screw after impact use stripped cross head round on one.

That aggravation now out of the way, the oil pump out and starter clutch pieces parts out for inspection. I discover, much to my chagrin, that the plunger for one of the rollers is STUCK compressed, allowing one roller to not make pressured contact with the gear it is supposed to engage. A couple bangs with a hammer pops it out.

Now what?

I probably am going to replace the rollers anyway.

It's only money, right?