TOPIC:

Any idea if I was close to right about it lowering the air temperature and increasing density?

I like to know how things work. Thanks for the replies.

KC-135 Tankers A Models used water injection during take-off's as well. And yes it felt like someone kicked in the nitrous!

I believe you are correct about it lowering the temp and making it denser but it's been so long I don't remember how accurate that is.

GargantuChet wrote:

Any idea if I was close to right about it lowering the air temperature and increasing density?

I like to know how things work. Thanks for the replies.

Yes, lowering the air/fuel mixture make the intake charge denser.

In the early 1980's,in a car magazine, Smokey Unik (the drag racer guy) took a Fiero 4Cyl and by heating the intake charge up was able to get 250HP and 50 MPG.
He said it was simple physics that when the intake charge is heated up, it combust easier and more efficently. Any one else see this article?

Daniel

Smokey Unik was genius! I've seen and read about several of his inventions. I've always been amazed that more of his ideas didn't make it into production.

Interesting where this thread has wandered...

We seem to be talking about three things:


Seafoam and it's possible impact on fuel economy.

Water or water/methanol injection to boost power by cooling the intake charge, thereby making it denser.

Smokey Yunick's adiabatic Hot Vapor Cycle Engine, which heated the intake charge, causing it to expand.


The second and third topics seem to be counter to each other and don't seem to have much to do with the first! I know one thing: A lot of guys a lot smarter than me have worked a long time on these concepts.

I think I'm going to go fiddle with my pilot screws...


This post was doubled. I deleted the second one. KZCSI

Post edited by: KZCSI, at: 2005/10/16 14:40

Smokey's logic doesn't seem correct. When you heat the intake mixture, you're pre-expanding it, which is bad. You want the mixture to expand as much as possible throughout the power stroke, hence why diesels are so efficient due to their high compression ratios. Ideally, you would compress the A/F down to zero volume and absolute zero temperature, then let the expansion occur (impossible. Any initial expansion is in effect robbing the potential of the mixture.

I would explain his increase in power by stating that warmer intake allows the air and fuel to mix better (think about when your bike doesn't start when it's cold out - it's because the fuel doesn't atomize correctly). Therefore, the mixture is homogeneous throughout the cylinder, and there are no "dead spots" or other weird things that can happen.

OK put it like this:
When you raise temp you also increase pressure. Vis versa. When you decrease temp you lower presure. Thats how an A/C system works.
Interesting how you guys talked about smokey:woohoo:
I read about him throuhg a bunch of magazines I found in a basement when I was younger. The magazines were old hot rod and chevy edditions. They were wrapped up in plastic. I should have held on to them I found out they were every eddition to hot rod and chevy from day one. I sold them for 20 dallars all two boxes of them:angry: I should have held on to them.

I almost forgot
The sea foam I take vacume line and run it to each intake runner then to one vacume line and put it in the bottle of seafoam. I rev it up and unclamp the vise grips on the main vacume line to the seafoam bottle and let the engine stall. I let it sit for a little bit 5min. then stat it up and blast away with carb clean through the carbs.
I did this to an engine before I took it apart and it cleaned the intake, valves, piston top and upper piston rings, and the exhaust valves the carbon was not as hard, hell it wiped right off:ohmy:

More on Sea Foam at www.webbikeworld.com/sea-foam/

-S

I swear by Sea Foam every cents my old buddy Pete turned me on to it numerous years ago. Pete is a Minnesota farm boy, Viet Nam vet, small engine mechanic extraordinaire, and all around mechanical man. He would not steer me wrong. Sea Foam does a good job of cleaning carbs both big and small. The last tank I ran thru the Kaw with it added, I too gained about 4 mpg (54, up from 50) so we may be on to something here!
In the 60's Fender Stratocasters came painted "Sea Foam Green".....of course this was many years after Sea Foam for motors came on the market!

I haven't used the Seafoam since my first post in October, but today I checked my mileage and it is at 47mpg. It keeps going up, and I can't explain it as my riding habits don't vary much. I have run 2-3 tanks of gas since October without it, and mileage went up 1-2 mpg each time.

If this keeps up pretty soon I will be able to fill up once a year

OKC_Kent wrote:

I haven't used the Seafoam since my first post in October, but today I checked my mileage and it is at 47mpg. It keeps going up, and I can't explain it as my riding habits don't vary much. I have run 2-3 tanks of gas since October without it, and mileage went up 1-2 mpg each time.

If this keeps up pretty soon I will be able to fill up once a year

Tailwind both ways:whistle:
Pat