Possible solution on retaining kick starter with rearsets

About 2 years ago I lucked out and scored a really nice used set of Raask rearsets on eBay for my KZ650.

I really love the riding position! But having them mounted on my bike has created a slight problem.
I can no longer use my kick starter since the right side rearset assy is in the direct path of the kick starter pedal travel.
The peg does fold up, but the bracket and brake linkage is actually what is in the way.

I had thought of just making a longer kick starter boss to place the pedal far enough out to clear the rearset. Of course I'd obviously need to fab some kind of brace/externaly mounted bearing support to compensate for the added leverage it would place on the kick starter shaft to prevent premature seal wear and/or engine damage.
But that in itself seems like over-engineering something so simple.

Anyway!
While talking to wagonmaster on the phone the other day about our KZ's, something he said gave me a great idea on a possible solution.

I'm thinking of trying to fab up something similar to the forward controls used on cruisers.
Placed just slightly forward, the kick starter could have just enough clearance to be functional, but not so far forward as to make it a PIA to use.
A "new" kick starter shaft/pivot for the pedal would be welded to the frame, and then using a couple of small heim joints and a piece of all-thread, have it run back and attach to a bolt-on boss that mounts to the original kick starter shaft/pivot point.
Unlike the original bolted-on kick starter pedal design, when not in use it could actually be stored under the seat like on the 900(?) to keep it out of the way and to keep the bikes appearance from becoming cluttered.

I know others have simply used rearsets from a current sportbike and mounted them higher up and further back to allow use of the kickstarter. But I don't think my trashed knees can handle being bent any further than they are with the Raask rearsets, so going that route really isn't a feasable option for me.

So, does anyone have any reasons why this can't/shouldn't be done, or any suggestions to improve on the design itself? :huh:

I think a sketch of the idea would help, Im not sure if Im picturing it the way you are

Ok, but keep in mind, this is a VERY rough sketch! :pinch:

LINK TO SKETCH

The boss that mounts to the orignal kick starter shaft/pivot coming out of the trans would have the heim joint mounted on the bottom side, and the boss that mounts to the "new" kick starter shaft/pivot would have the heim joint mounted on the top side. By doing so, it will keep the original down and backwards motion when kick starting the bike.
Granted, the true angle at which the heim joints sit will have to be adjusted to allow a full kick and turn the engine over. But I figure that just like with the linkage on rearsets, this can be adjusted as needed to a certain extent.

I even thought of just welding the "new" kick starter shaft/pivot onto the frame a few inches forward and right below the original one coming from the engine, and then having the kick start motion go in the opposite direction - down and forward.
This actually might be an even better idea. Being smaller in size it will be stronger, and would probably lessen some of the leverage being placed on the engine kick starter shaft. And having it travel forward instead of backwards would allow a greater amount of "kick" to be applied without fear of catching my heel on something.

I'll try to get out to the garage later on and take a pic of my bike and use MS paint to draw arrows to the areas I mentioned to give a better idea of what I'm thinking.

EDIT: Danged pic size limitations!

Post edited by: RetroRiceRocketRider, at: 2006/12/31 14:53

ok that could work. the only issue I see would be having enough degrees of rotation. you may not get a full "kick" out of the design, but I could be wrong. and a bike that is in good tune doesnt always need a full kick anyway, so it may not be an issue anyway

That's nuts! Creative, sure, but crazy!

Here's the big obvious dumb question: Why not just heat up the kicker lever and bend it out so it clears the Raask bracket?

guitargeek wrote:

Here's the big obvious dumb question: Why not just heat up the kicker lever and bend it out so it clears the Raask bracket?

For a few simple reasons.
1) It would need to be bent outwards quite a bit, since the outer edge of the kick lever currently hits about 2" in from the tip of the footpeg.
2) That's an awfully thick lever to try heating and bending! :ohmy:
3) Even if I were able to heat and bend it to a useable angle, there's no guarante that it's integrity will survive the heating, bending and ensuing leverage that would be placed on it during kick starting.
4) It would change the lever from somewhat of an "L" shape into either an "I" shape, or somewhat similar to the angle of a hockey stick.
And that would increase the amount of leverage placed on the kick starter shaft and possibly cause seal and/or engine damage, which is counter-productive to what I'm after.

I wonder how hard it would be to adapt a pull starter from a lawnmower...

for $20, i'd try this solution:

www.tiny.cc/DYDSK

the long version......

- at least it works for 750 sohc hondas with raask rearsets:
www.sohc4.us/forums/index.php?topic=12003.0

- worth trying even though the kz650 kickstart linkage looks different:
kzrider.com/index.php?option=com_ponygal...&func=detail&id=1786

- in the old days, they bent the right side (gear shift) linkage to accomodate the kick starter, rather than vice versa:

img341.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rearsets01tr5.jpg

img396.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rearsets02uj5.jpg

Don't know squat about the various clearances and angles involved, but it looks like an interesting application for a pittman arm-type setup something akin to steam locomotive drives - ...

Might help if you can resize the pics and show it from a few angles...

duncan wrote:

for $20, i'd try this solution:

www.tiny.cc/DYDSK

the long version......

- at least it works for 750 sohc hondas with raask rearsets:
www.sohc4.us/forums/index.php?topic=12003.0

- worth trying even though the kz650 kickstart linkage looks different:
kzrider.com/index.php?option=com_ponygal...&func=detail&id=1786

- in the old days, they bent the right side (gear shift) linkage to accomodate the kick starter, rather than vice versa:

img341.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rearsets01tr5.jpg

img396.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rearsets02uj5.jpg

yeah that seems like a lot easier fix,and you could just fine tune it if you had to;)

I have rearsets on my 650 and simpky thumb the starter button. Removed the kick starter about 20 years ago. Is there something wrong with your starter?

baldy110 wrote:

I have rearsets on my 650 and simpky thumb the starter button. Removed the kick starter about 20 years ago. Is there something wrong with your starter?

The starter works perfectly, however the starter clutch does slip every so often.
Basically I like the piece of mind that if for some odd reason my battery craps out that I still can start her without resorting to getting a heart attack trying to push start her. :pinch: