KZR's Bikes of the Month for 2024

Two carbs getting gas, two do not.

  • hardrockminer
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07 Jun 2023 20:06 - 08 Jun 2023 03:56 #885760 by hardrockminer
Replied by hardrockminer on topic Two carbs getting gas, two do not.
You need to be careful when installing the bowls.  Sometimes the float will get stuck on the side of the bowl.

I would remove the carbs from the bike and remove the bowl from #2 carb.  Attach the tank and see if fuel flows through the float valve.  If it does, then reinstall the bowl, remove the drain and try running fuel again.  If it doesn't then check your float valve for a blockage.

Do you have a vacuum petcock or is it simply gravity fed?

I have several restored bikes along with a 2006 Goldwing with a sidecar. My wife has a 2019 Suzuki DR 650 for on and off road.
Last edit: 08 Jun 2023 03:56 by hardrockminer.

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08 Jun 2023 06:38 #885768 by SRQ Mike
Replied by SRQ Mike on topic Two carbs getting gas, two do not.

Have you tried removing the float and needle assembly, put the bowl back on and turn on the fuel - does the bowl now flood?
Yes: fault relates to the float or needle
No: fault is a blockage in the carb body
Further update:  This morning I ran the above test suggested by Wookie.  Surprisingly to me, all carbs got fuel.  (I was to the point of assuming that number 2 had a blockage).  So,  now it's trying to determine the problem with the float or the needle.   Progress!  Thanks Wookie!  All float needles appear to be OK. Should I replace them just to be certain?  What is the proper float height?  I'm reading 24 mm but am not certain that's correct.  

1979 Kawasaki KZ650 SR
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08 Jun 2023 06:46 #885769 by SRQ Mike
Replied by SRQ Mike on topic Two carbs getting gas, two do not.

You need to be careful when installing the bowls.  Sometimes the float will get stuck on the side of the bowl.

I would remove the carbs from the bike and remove the bowl from #2 carb.  Attach the tank and see if fuel flows through the float valve.  If it does, then reinstall the bowl, remove the drain and try running fuel again.  If it doesn't then check your float valve for a blockage.

Do you have a vacuum petcock or is it simply gravity fed?
It's a vacuum petcock.  (See my other post for a general update).   Another reply suggested that a tear in the petcock diaphragm could cause a fuel problem in carb 2.   Is this correct?  (I did rebuild the petcock including a new diaphragm)  

1979 Kawasaki KZ650 SR

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  • hardrockminer
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08 Jun 2023 15:02 #885789 by hardrockminer
Replied by hardrockminer on topic Two carbs getting gas, two do not.
OK, so you're using the vacuum port on #2 carb to operate the petcock.  

Do you have a maintenance manual for the bike?  There is a section on how to decide if the float needles need replacing.  I've never seen the need to replace them.

I'm not 100% sure about your carbs, but mine are 1978 version and the correct height is 3.5 mm from the top of the bowl, plus or minus 1 mm.

I have several restored bikes along with a 2006 Goldwing with a sidecar. My wife has a 2019 Suzuki DR 650 for on and off road.
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  • gd4now
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08 Jun 2023 15:09 #885790 by gd4now
Replied by gd4now on topic Two carbs getting gas, two do not.
Here are some of the carb tables from some FSMs which show both design and service levels for float/fuel level.

1977 KZ650 B1
Pods and Denco header


OLD KAW OWNERS SMILE ALOT

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  • hardrockminer
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09 Jun 2023 03:42 #885802 by hardrockminer
Replied by hardrockminer on topic Two carbs getting gas, two do not.
According to the info in the previous post your fuel level should be 3 mm plus or minus 1 mm.  Stated another way...between 2 mm and 4 mm.

I have several restored bikes along with a 2006 Goldwing with a sidecar. My wife has a 2019 Suzuki DR 650 for on and off road.
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03 Jul 2023 07:13 #886766 by SRQ Mike
Replied by SRQ Mike on topic Two carbs getting gas, two do not.
Update:  After repeated attempts to get fuel flowing to carbs 2 & 3 I asked for help from a guy who lives nearby and makes excellent YouTube videos.  ( MotoResto Florida - YouTube
I found him totally be accident by watching several of his videos and realizing that he lives about three miles away.  Anyway, he looked at the carbs and quickly realized that the float needles on carbs two and three were sticking.  After replacing the float needles the problem was resolved.  Also, he helped me set the fuel level by using the clear tube method.  The bike is now running on all four cylinders.  The remaining issue is a mild backfire through the exhaust.  Ideas?  

This has been a good learning experience for a 75 year-old amateur motorcycle mechanic.  Thanks for all your ideas.  

1979 Kawasaki KZ650 SR
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  • Wookie58
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03 Jul 2023 07:18 #886767 by Wookie58
Replied by Wookie58 on topic Two carbs getting gas, two do not.
Good to hear you got the fuel supply sorted, ref the popping in the exhaust - how old are your rubber manifolds (sounds like an air leak issue) ?
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03 Jul 2023 07:37 #886770 by SRQ Mike
Replied by SRQ Mike on topic Two carbs getting gas, two do not.
The rubber manifolds/boots on the carbs?  They are almost new.  I replaced the ones from the airbox to the carbs and the others appear in good shape.  
 

1979 Kawasaki KZ650 SR
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03 Jul 2023 08:21 - 03 Jul 2023 08:25 #886771 by Warren3200gt
Replied by Warren3200gt on topic Two carbs getting gas, two do not.
Backfiring back through the carbs is mostly caused by lean fuel supply, be it either an air leak or lean fuel air ratio settings.(which amounts to the same thing). 
Back firing through the exhaust is almost the opposite. Partially burnt/unburnt fuel is being pushed out the exhaust valve/s. Once the ratio of fuel vapour and oxygen reaches optimum, bearing in mind its mostly carbon monoxide in there, the next hot exhaust valve cycle ignites it. 
Finding the reason for unburnt fuel is the hardest part. Inefficient combustion caused by dirty/fouled/poorly earthed/badly gapped plugs or low voltage supply to the coils is the most likely cause. 


Z1000J2 somewhat modified!

Last edit: 03 Jul 2023 08:25 by Warren3200gt.
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03 Jul 2023 11:42 #886791 by SRQ Mike
Replied by SRQ Mike on topic Two carbs getting gas, two do not.
It was an air leak.  In my excitement and haste to get the carbs back on the bike and hear it run,  I failed to tighten the clamps on the intake tubes.  
Maybe it's senility, but I would never admit to that.  

Thanks again for all the ideas.  I'm not only pleased with how it's running, I'm happy with all that I'm learning.  

1979 Kawasaki KZ650 SR
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  • Wookie58
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03 Jul 2023 11:46 #886792 by Wookie58
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