TOPIC:

swest wrote: No, they are ether mis installed, bent or the wrong ones.
Steve

Shiiiiiit

Yes,...something is wrong. I am not that familiar with the 650's but the Z1 website states 2 are used,..not 4? also maybe you pushed them in past the bevel inside the swing arm. Here is some pics of when I recently did mone.

blink543 wrote:

JimB wrote: I wrote grinded but I actually just used some sand paper. I do not think some rust would make it that hard to get in. Take a good look and make sure some bearings did not pop out and are stopping the sleeve from going it. Just for the heck of it did you try to turn the sleeve around and/or push it in the other end of the swing arm first?

Yes I did but upon looking at the old bearings vs the new. They are both the same size but the new ones have a different needle height compared to the old so that must be the problem. Wtf why can't needle bearings just be the same

Probably because the old ones were worn out.
Back when these bikes were fairly new/low mileage it would of been no big deal to just change out the bearings and reusing the sock sleeve.
But now that a lot of these bikes have lots of hard miles on them and many of them went for years without seeing a grease its really important to inspect everything.
Another thing I always suggest on these old bikes that have been used and abused is to have a machine shop line hone the pivot opening on the swingarm to make sure its straight,Especially if going from bushings or single needle bearings to double needle bearings on each side.

blink543 wrote:

JimB wrote: Hummm,....and I bet you did not try the new bearings on the sleeve prior to installation right? Do you have a micrometer to check them versus just eyeing them up? Especially prior to removing them.

But if you are actually having to hammer the sleeve in then something is wrong wrt the size of the bearings. Or they got ruined while installing them. having to do it a second time would really suck.

That sucks,...I know how frustrated you must be, I spent all day getting the old ones out. I actually used the swing are bolt to try to get the old ones out and deformed the end so much that I had to get a new one, So,...I am good a breaking things also.

I used a threaded bolt, washers, and nuts (and socket for the deep ones) to pull the new bearings in versus using a hammer to make sure I did not deform them.

Yeah I didn't check them on the sleeve before installing them. I assumed they would fit. I forgot that the sleeve was supposed to go in easily. I bought these bearings off Amazon because they were the same size. The need height is too high or whatever. I'm really not sure the purpose of the bearings honestly. I didn't wanna get the bearings off z1 enterprises for $11 each. No thanks. I'm gonna just have to somehow get these bearings out now.

The bearings or bushings are there to allow the sleeve to move inside the pivot tube to spin when the swingarm pivots.

PLUMMEN wrote:

blink543 wrote:

JimB wrote: Hummm,....and I bet you did not try the new bearings on the sleeve prior to installation right? Do you have a micrometer to check them versus just eyeing them up? Especially prior to removing them.

But if you are actually having to hammer the sleeve in then something is wrong wrt the size of the bearings. Or they got ruined while installing them. having to do it a second time would really suck.

That sucks,...I know how frustrated you must be, I spent all day getting the old ones out. I actually used the swing are bolt to try to get the old ones out and deformed the end so much that I had to get a new one, So,...I am good a breaking things also.

I used a threaded bolt, washers, and nuts (and socket for the deep ones) to pull the new bearings in versus using a hammer to make sure I did not deform them.

Yeah I didn't check them on the sleeve before installing them. I assumed they would fit. I forgot that the sleeve was supposed to go in easily. I bought these bearings off Amazon because they were the same size. The need height is too high or whatever. I'm really not sure the purpose of the bearings honestly. I didn't wanna get the bearings off z1 enterprises for $11 each. No thanks. I'm gonna just have to somehow get these bearings out now.

The bearings or bushings are there to allow the sleeve to move inside the pivot tube to spin when the swingarm pivots.

Well for some reason these bearings aren't allowing the sleeve to turn inside the swing arm

I also noticed when I had the sleeve and the bearings inside and decided to put it on the bike when I put the bolt through the swing arm and tightened it, it was hard to move the swing arm up and down. But when I loosened it it was a little easier.

One more thing. On the diagram it shows bushings on the swing arm but I had only bearings. Can I use either or with this swing arm? It's the 1978 kz650b to be precise.

JimB wrote: Yes,...something is wrong. I am not that familiar with the 650's but the Z1 website states 2 are used,..not 4? also maybe you pushed them in past the bevel inside the swing arm. Here is some pics of when I recently did mone.

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Attachment IMG_1692.jpg not found

Attachment IMG_1693.jpg not found

Well 4 came out of my swing arm originally so I'm putting 4 in.

The sleeves are not meant to turn inside the swing arm, it should remain stationary, thus the need to press them in with the bolt /washer/nut tool. This sleeve is in essence the outer race of the bearing set-up The needle bearings rotate on the sleeve on the O.D. side and on the bolt that goes thru the frame/swing arm itself. On the I.D. side.In essence the Inner race That is the way i have always seen needle bearings operate

If needed -- link to FSM download:

jarlef.no/Kawasaki/PDF/Z650/Files/KZ650-1981manual.pdf

See swing arm on pages 2-24, 4-16 and 7-31.

Good Fortune!

That's right. The bearing has to move freely not the race. Time to buy the ones from Z1E.
That's right, they're too expensive I forgot.
Steve

ezrider714 wrote: The sleeves are not meant to turn inside the swing arm, it should remain stationary, thus the need to press them in with the bolt /washer/nut tool. This sleeve is in essence the outer race of the bearing set-up The needle bearings rotate on the sleeve on the O.D. side and on the bolt that goes thru the frame/swing arm itself. On the I.D. side.In essence the Inner race That is the way i have always seen needle bearings operate

I think you mean the inner race,
Theres no reason the sleeve shouldnt turn that Im aware of anyway.