TOPIC:

So I got the new pan and gasket in, the pan appears slightly different, but only cosmetically, There's an extra fin on the outside, the drain plug is a bit smaller, and there's a small baffle on the inside under the transmission, but it bolted up perfectly.

At the suggestion of the guy at the part store, I put some Indian Head on the gasket, never heard of it but sounds great for preventing oil leaks and holding everything in place during the install.

While torquing down the pan to a whopping 8 ft/lbs, I broke two bolts. a third made the same popping sound, but when I removed it, it looked perfect. The first one didnt break completely, so it came out whole, the third though, broke off completely, leaving about 2 rounds of threads sticking out of the block. Not sure how I'm going to remove it.

I sprayed a little PB blaster on it and tried to pull it with a set of needle nose but that didn't work.

Spikito wrote: So I got the new pan and gasket in, the pan appears slightly different, but only cosmetically, There's an extra fin on the outside, the drain plug is a bit smaller, and there's a small baffle on the inside under the transmission, but it bolted up perfectly.

At the suggestion of the guy at the part store, I put some Indian Head on the gasket, never heard of it but sounds great for preventing oil leaks and holding everything in place during the install.

While torquing down the pan to a whopping 8 ft/lbs, I broke two bolts. a third made the same popping sound, but when I removed it, it looked perfect. The first one didnt break completely, so it came out whole, the third though, broke off completely, leaving about 2 rounds of threads sticking out of the block. Not sure how I'm going to remove it.

I sprayed a little PB blaster on it and tried to pull it with a set of needle nose but that didn't work.

I'll ask in advance for forgiveness on being so blunt, but I don't even know why I took the time to warn you about applying too much torque. Notice in the previous posting I stated:

"Be sure to use a torque wrench calibrated in INCH pounds and torque the oil pan bolts to the light side of the specs in the manual along with a new gasket. You really do not want to strip out any of those oil pan bolt hole threads."

Then you go ahead like King Kong with a FOOT POUND torque wrench and try to torque the bolts way, way over the specified torque spec to (in your own words) "a whopping 8 ft/lbs." You don't just break one, not good enough, you keep going trying to break them all. Dude, what were you thinking??? 8 foot pounds - really! 8 foot pounds = 96 INCH pounds! The spec is 61 - 78 INCH pounds. A reasonable max level on a machine this old would have been 70 INCH pounds, but you cranked it up 37% higher. So it's not surprising that you are now trying to figure out how to fix what was so easy to avoid.

End of rant. Ed

First off, you said to avoid over torquing to avoid stripping threads, I stripped exactly zero threads, I broke a bolt, My local Japanese bike mechanic told me this happens to him all the time with older bikes and what happens is that the bolt gets weakened because it takes a lot more than 8 ft/lbs to remove these bolts, so then they break under 3 or 4 ft/lbs during re-install. He doesn't even try to re-use old bolts and keeps tons of new ones in stock, and he supplied me with a whole new set.

I don't know where you got 61-78 inch lbs from, but my manual instructed 104 in/lbs,, which comes to 8.666 ft/lbs So I went with 8, I didn't pull 8 out of my ass, I got to that number by looking at the manual, AND heeding your advice.
and yes, 8 is tiny, from what I can tell, that is the softest torque setting of any part on the bike. The last thing I used my torque wrench for was 125 FOOT lbs. the weight of the wrench was almost enough to set it off.

The first bolt didn't actually break, it just cracked, but it seemed like the sound came from the wrench, after all, it was my older wrench and hadn't been used in awhile, and it was set at the bottom of its range. plus it felt like i had only applied about half the torque I had applied to the other bolts, in fact it was only about 1/2 turn past finger tight. The second one, which was actually the very last bolt I installed, is the one that actually broke.

I also went to every tool store in my town and could not find an inch lb wrench, and my motorcycle mechanic neighbor didn't have one either, so I was forced to utilize the foot lb wrench.

Fixing the problem took 10 minutes with an EZ-out, and now I have a whole set of shiny new stainless bolts, that I don't have to worry about.

If possible, use some of the silver Anti-seize on any SS or steel bolts going into Aluminum engine cases, as this is dis-similar metals, and can gall and seize. Just a small amount on the first few threads is about all you'll need.

Spikito wrote: First off, you said to avoid over torquing to avoid stripping threads, I stripped exactly zero threads, I broke a bolt, My local Japanese bike mechanic told me this happens to him all the time with older bikes and what happens is that the bolt gets weakened because it takes a lot more than 8 ft/lbs to remove these bolts, so then they break under 3 or 4 ft/lbs during re-install. He doesn't even try to re-use old bolts and keeps tons of new ones in stock, and he supplied me with a whole new set.

I don't know where you got 61-78 inch lbs from, but my manual instructed 104 in/lbs,, which comes to 8.666 ft/lbs So I went with 8, I didn't pull 8 out of my ass, I got to that number by looking at the manual, AND heeding your advice.
and yes, 8 is tiny, from what I can tell, that is the softest torque setting of any part on the bike. The last thing I used my torque wrench for was 125 FOOT lbs. the weight of the wrench was almost enough to set it off.

The first bolt didn't actually break, it just cracked, but it seemed like the sound came from the wrench, after all, it was my older wrench and hadn't been used in awhile, and it was set at the bottom of its range. plus it felt like i had only applied about half the torque I had applied to the other bolts, in fact it was only about 1/2 turn past finger tight. The second one, which was actually the very last bolt I installed, is the one that actually broke.

I also went to every tool store in my town and could not find an inch lb wrench, and my motorcycle mechanic neighbor didn't have one either, so I was forced to utilize the foot lb wrench.

Fixing the problem took 10 minutes with an EZ-out, and now I have a whole set of shiny new stainless bolts, that I don't have to worry about.

First problem – wrong torque wrench. Torqueing small bolts requires a torque wrench calibrated in INCH pounds. I would urge you to buy one from the internet if there is no store in your local area that carries one; it really will save you grief in the future. Here’s why - If your torque wrench is calibrated up to 125 foot pounds it is far, far too large to measure anything under 10 foot pounds. Even top quality torque wrenches are not accurate for readings less than 20% of their full scale, which means a torque wrench that is calibrated up to 125 foot pounds is not accurate at settings below 25 foot pounds. Notice CDI, the Snap-On torque wrench company, states: “All mechanical torque wrenches are calibrated from 20% to 100% of full scale, therefore, they should never be used below or above those limits.” See www.cditorque.com/education.html#Safety

Second problem – I don’t know what manual you are using, but I would suggest you check with others about the torque values it shows. Is it a Kawasaki Service Manual or a Haynes or Clymer book? I know that not all Kawasaki manuals give identical information, but if yours shows 104 inch pounds for 6mm bolts I would tear those pages out so I didn’t use them again. Notice below the torque values from my Kawasaki Service Manual for the oil pan bolts and the general torque values when a specific bolt is not called out in the table. They are not even close to 104 inch pounds.

Sorry I sounded harsh, and I’m glad you were able to get the broken bolts out, but I would recommend you reconsider the torque values and try to get your hands on a small torque wrench to avoid torque related problems in the future. Ed

5.5ft/lb on a 6mm bolt. That is 66 or so inch/lb. Some manuals over the years would advise higher torque, but that always resulted in stripped threads. I never broke a bolt in my life, but stripped many, and I think many of those were due to using a ft/lb torque wrench. A torque wrench is not accurate in the lower point of its capacity. Like Ed mentioned, get an inch/lb wrench and don't believe specs that appear over the norm. 8ft/lb on a 6mm bolt into aluminum is not going to work obviously.

sounds good, i found an auto store that rents tools that have an inch/lb wrench.

the bolt that broke, and the one that cracked offered very little resistance, like i said, i was only 1/4 to 1/2 turn past finger tight when they popped. i had JUST started the wrench, based on how the others felt, they broke at 3-4 ft lbs.

Your manual is much different than mine, I like that ways yours is listed, Mine is a pdf of one of the orginial kz1000 manuals. since this bike was make for 30+ years I'm sure there is a lot of variation in suggestions. Mine doesnt have much in the way of set lists. I just had to read the instructions on swapping the oil pump and find it in there.

Is it for certain that the pan bolts are the correct length?

Good Fortune!

new ones or old ones?

The old ones are the ones I pulled out of the pan when i removed it, and this bike was bone stock when I bought it. They look just the replacements ive seen online.

The steel replacements I bought are the same length, and the stainless I bought a about 2mm longer, but I got washers.

Oil pan is back on, torqued everything down to 65 in/lbs with the new allen head bolts. Everything appears to be in working order. I' gonna let it cure overnight and recheck the torque tomorrow and hopefully put the oil in.

Spikito wrote: new ones or old ones?

The old ones are the ones I pulled out of the pan when i removed it, and this bike was bone stock when I bought it. They look just the replacements ive seen online.

The steel replacements I bought are the same length, and the stainless I bought a about 2mm longer, but I got washers.

Washers???? That sounds jacked up to me. Why wouldn't you just shorten the bolts?

how would you go about shortening the bolt while maintaining thread integrity at the end? Id hate for a bur to gouge up the block side threads