TOPIC:

I'm not even positive all of the 3-phase stators from 650's and 750's will fit. OnkelB has done this swap so he probably has done the research on it. Hopefully he will chime in. If the rotor's match with your rotor part number, then the stator will likely fit. You don't need a whole sub-harness, as you are only adding a single wire. But it wouldn't hurt if you can get the harness.

From my data bases:

Kawasaki Kz650 Charging Upgrade

Looked here? KZ650.info www.kz650.info/

Read this also:

1979 650 B2 Charging Upgrade

From the KZrider.com - Home www.kzrider.com
website)

Ok, I had a problem with the battery discharging instead if charging after I fitted a Dyna s ignition, charging system was coping marginally with the power needed to run the extra relays, ecu, fuel pump and heated WBO2 setup that I use for the EFI that I have on my 650.

If I used the headlights the voltage on the palm pilot display dropped to around 12 volts or less and at traffic lights it would drop to high 10 to low 11 volts.
After searching for info on this site and KZ650.info I found that the single phase stator that the 650b2 uses has the same dimensions as the 3 phase stator used in later 650s and early 750's. I found that electrosports make a high output stator ( approx 20%) more output than the late model 650 , early 750 models which had 21% more power than the B2 single phase unit.

This works out to between 40 to 50% increase.
Lou and told me that I would need the 3 phase regulator/rectifier as well as the new stator. I got these parts from Pacific motorsports ebay shop and used the original 1phase rotor.
When the parts arrived I removed the 1 phase stator (2 wire) and fitted the 3 phase one ( 3 wire) with the original rubber grommet that seals the housing.

There is a dimple where the 3rd wire goes, so I drilled the hole with a battery drill and a drill the same size as the stator wire.
I ran the 3 yellow stator wires to the one side of the 6 pin connector that I bought at the local car spares shop (which luckily enough turned out to be the same as the one on the electrosport regulator/rectifier), but I will have to cut the wires and put bullet connector in the wires when I remove the engine or the stator cover in the future.

The white wire is the output to the battery, I connected this one to the white and red one that was used with the original 1 phase regulator and the same with the black wire that connects to ground. The brown wire is the regulator load wire (connects to the 12v switched wire that i traced back from the rear brake light positive wire)
and that was it.
Used the bike for about 300KM now and the charging is all good

Parts were:-
1 x Electrosport ESR370 Regulator/Rectifier $89.95 from Pacific motorsports
1 x Electrosport ESG010 Heavy duty 3 phase Stator $109.99 from Pacific Motorsports
http://sto...-Powersports-Accessories
Hope this info is useful for anyone else with a 650B2 that is converting from ! phase to 3 phase charging system. Special thanks to Lou (loudhvx) and Bo (onkelb)and incognito0160 as well as all the other guys who gave advise and ideas.
---End Quote---
Hello -- Newbie here. I just wanted to state that I did the upgrade as described and it seems to have allevioated the charging problem. I had narrowed down the problem to the dyna ignition drawing too much power. I decided to try this and it worked. Woo-Hoo! Thanks guys.

Thanks, that will help.

I also ran across this discussion, the 650 ran both types of alternators it seems,

z650.proboards.com/thread/48

There were 3 type of KZ650 alternators. The first, 1977 B1 and C1 only, were the excited field 3 phase type. The later 3 phase alternator was set up differently. You can spot the 1977 type easily by looking at the alternator cover. It has 3 Allen screws that hold the field coil in place. (see image below). Ed

I'm not sure if all 650/750 stators will work either, the one I'm using is the Electrex G01 and a corresponding 3-phase reg/rec in a 79 D2 (SR) engine. with the original D2 single phase rotor, works just fine. I'm also running a Dyna-S, never had any charging problems.

www.electrexworld.co.uk/acatalog/G01.html

There's a bike model list and some additional info below the picture in the link, the 650 E1 is listed there.

Note: Whether you decide to get the G01 or a used stator from another bike, make sure it's no larger than the dimensions listed for the G01 (Outer Diameter: 93mm Inner diameter: 35mm Thickness through hole: 18mm) or it won't fit inside the rotor.

I rewired the whole bike when I swapped engines but as Lou says there's no need to modify the harness much to go 3-phase - you're just adding an extra wire from the stator to the reg/rec, the 3-phase reg/rec have the same connections to the harness (output, ground and sense wire) as the 1-phase.

Tyler wrote: Thanks, that will help.

I also ran across this discussion, the 650 ran both types of alternators it seems,

z650.proboards.com/thread/48

EDIT: Some of this was covered by Ed and Bo, as I was typing.

Actually, that discussion is talking about the 77 KZ650 3-phase alternator. (I'm not sure, but I think I wrote that initially quoted description). That is a totally different animal than the later 3-phase systems.

The first 650 in 1977 had a field coil type alternator with 3-phase stator. That had a totally different rotor and stator than all other 650's. It can be identified by three screws in a triangle pattern on the alternator cover. This also had a separate regulator and rectifier.

In 1978 they went to a single-phase stator, permanent-magnet alternator. None of the components will swap with the 1977 charging system.

Then in 1980 or 1981 they went to a 3-phase stator, permanent-magnet alternator and reg/rec, but it still used the same rotor. The reg/rec had to add a third yellow wire, but it also added a brown wire used to sense the battery voltage.

I forgot to mention, if you use a stock 3-phase reg/rec with your new 3-phase stator, you will have to add this brown wire. It is simply a switched 12v source, same as powers some of the rest of the bike, like marker lights and ignition. This wire must have 12v for the regulator to regulate. It doesn't take much power at all, so you can tap it from the ignition 12v. Or if you get an aftermarket 3-phase reg/rec, it may not have the brown wire.

Just for future reference I might add that the early 650 3-phase system (excited field) works very well with a Dyna-S, ran my original B1 engine with that for years without issues - the main reason I went with the Electrex unit when I swapped engines was that the D2 engine I rebuilt came without a stator. Since I wanted to use the D2 stator cover I had to change to permanent magnet and thought I might as well go 3-phase when I was at it anyway...

To test out this theory I pulled the fuse for the headlight and fired up the bike, low and behold there was 14V at the battery with it running. So I'm convinced that this is a over-draw problem. I built this bike 4 years ago, and have had the dyna installed ever since, Though I used to ride another bike around town and would just take the 650 out of town to play around. Last year I drove the 650 to work quite often and that's when the problem started happening. Slower engine speeds in town probably make the problem much worse and the battery would lose charge.

I found a used stator from an '81 650 for $20 on e-bay and the corresponding regulator for another whopping $15. I can try this and see how it works. I may look into going with an OEM electronic ignition. I have had other bikes with early electronic ignitions on them that were trouble free.

It appears from further reading that the Dyna system runs a 300° dwell which energizes the coils longer for every revolution of the crank this causes the extra current draw. Points would have about 180° dwell ( I think).

OnkelB wrote: Just for future reference I might add that the early 650 3-phase system (excited field) works very well with a Dyna-S, ran my original B1 engine with that for years without issues - ...

I also found that system to work best. It gets a bad wrap for being complicated and the regulator is mechanical, but when working properly it was the most efficient when it comes to crankshaft power, heat dissipation, and was able to produce 14v at idle, on the bike I was testing, with headlight on and stock ignition.

loudhvx wrote:

OnkelB wrote: Just for future reference I might add that the early 650 3-phase system (excited field) works very well with a Dyna-S, ran my original B1 engine with that for years without issues - ...

I also found that system to work best. It gets a bad wrap for being complicated and the regulator is mechanical, but when working properly it was the most efficient when it comes to crankshaft power, heat dissipation, and was able to produce 14v at idle, on the bike I was testing, with headlight on and stock ignition.

Same here. I had the rectifier (which is separate on these models from the regulator) go bad when a diode failed, but other than that no problems at all in 37 years. I consider that pretty reliable. I replaced the rectifier with one from Oregon Motorcycle Parts and have had no other problems. Ed

All these years I've been running Dyna ignition and noticed my 650s always charged at about the 12.7v point and although low it has never caused my electric starter to not turn the engine over just fine as long as the battery was in good shape. I've run Dyna since 1979 and close to 250,000 miles on 650s.

Ok I got the parts in the other day. The cover is pretty nasty but the stator and wiring look useable. I did a quick bench test of the regulator and it checked out.



I cleaned up the parts and installed the stator in my cover. Its the same size as the stock unit, just has more windings on it. I modified the wiring that came with the 3-phase stator and 6 pin plug. My original R/R unit had a 3 wire connector.





Everything fit up nicely, Not bad for $35 and evening of tinkering around. Its late so I will wait till tomorrow to try it out.




Here is the R/R unit, same wiring scheme as the original unit, just one extra wire for the 3-phase alternator. Since the 6-pin plug was in nice shape I decided to use it. The new R/R unit is bigger but it uses the same bolt pattern, just need longer bolts.