Shorai Batteries

Lou, I think you are applying technical standards to what is essentially a marketing standard.

First:

Cold cranking amps (CCA) is a measurement of the number of amps a battery can deliver at 0 ° F for 30 seconds and not drop below 7.2 volts. So a high CCA battery rating is especially important in starting battery applications, and in cold weather

www.batterystuff.com/tutorial_battery.html#4

As an example:
So, if a battery maintains 24 volts at 60 amps during the CCA test, it will have a lower CCA rating than a battery that drops down to 8 volts at 65 amps in the same test, while producing many more watts.

As you well know, in a real life scenario as the voltage drops during cranking the amp draw increases. This is the cause of many a starter going bad (severely overheats)

I'd like to see a load test graph on the battery to see the relationship between voltage and amps under high load conditions (100 amps would work, maybe even 50)


Everyone see how voltage has nothing to do with CCA (as long as it's above 7.2)?

steell wrote:

Lou, I think you are applying technical standards to what is essentially a marketing standard.

First:

Cold cranking amps (CCA) is a measurement of the number of amps a battery can deliver at 0 ° F for 30 seconds and not drop below 7.2 volts. So a high CCA battery rating is especially important in starting battery applications, and in cold weather

www.batterystuff.com/tutorial_battery.html#4

As an example:
So, if a battery maintains 24 volts at 60 amps during the CCA test, it will have a lower CCA rating than a battery that drops down to 8 volts at 65 amps in the same test, while producing many more watts.

As you well know, in a real life scenario as the voltage drops during cranking the amp draw increases. This is the cause of many a starter going bad (severely overheats)

I'd like to see a load test graph on the battery to see the relationship between voltage and amps under high load conditions (100 amps would work, maybe even 50)


Everyone see how voltage has nothing to do with CCA (as long as it's above 7.2)?

I see now that CCA, like you said, is just a marketing definition. So then his point is that as long as the battery is at normal operating temperature, he can put out 2 more volts than a flooded battery, (or some other SLA)? Or at 0*F, his battery puts out two more volts, but then what are the amps at 0*F at 9.2v? Too many variables. Bottom line is that the starter is still turning slower at normal temps. Up here, where we are, no one wants to sit around waiting for a battery to warm up, when everyone else is halfway to the next bar. (They're very close where I live .)



I realize that when a motor is turning slower, the amps go up, and voltage goes down, but that is because the load has changed, and that also means the motor has slowed down. I presume we want to compare conditions for two batteries when the motor is turning at normal speed. If not, then all sorts of marketing claims could be made.

Something like "our battery delivers twice the power as normal batteries", but then you read the micro-fine print "when the starter motor has completely stalled and is almost melted".

BTW, I'm not saying I wouldn't try one of those batteries, because I'm done with acid splills and cleanup. (So much so that I'm willing to bump start, on hot days, wearing full gear, uphill both ways) . But the initial findings on the Goldwing does not sound promising. If, somehow, the Goldwing Shorai battery fits in my gpz, then maybe it's worth a try. At least I hope a Wing takes more power to start than my 550.

Yeah, I'd like to try one also, but at current prices that's not going to happen :woohoo:

Marketing speak, the same thing that allows manufacturers to produce an electric motor rated at 5 hp and FLA of 12 @ 220V.

No relation to reality at all.

The only useful spec for cranking Amps would be to spec it as a function of terminal voltage at several temperatures (cold, nominal, and hot). For a starter motor, any voltage between about 9.5V and 12V is good enough to work and you want to know how much current it can put out in that range.

As stated above, a starter motor is definitely not a simple passive load like a bulb and it's current demand does increase as voltage drops, which is the opposite of a resistive load.

Yes, unfortunately, to really rate batteries of different types, what you'd want is a voltage/current graph at various temperatures. That does not ranslate well into marketing, where they want one big number to represent everything. :laugh:

I guess the best thing is what's being done on the Goldwing site. Just try the sucker and see what happens. Luckily someone is willing to lay out the cash for our benefit. Mucho appreciated.

Not sure if this opens an ugly can of worms, but how about AGM versus GEL? I'm not worried so much about weight, just longevity, starting speed, and no more acid reflux.

Price, average life expectancy, cranking power?