No 'running lights' on the rear

KZ Riders - I need a hand with troubleshooting the read turn signals on my 83 KZ550 LTD.

When I turn the bike on, all the lights are on that should be, except the rear turn signals. When I use the turn signal indicator, those work fine, but the rear light are 'off' if they arent blinking.

How do I go about troubleshooting why the 'running light' portion of my rear turn signals arent working?

I have the Clymer and the original Kawasaki Service Manual, but neither really gets into anything like this.

Thanks all,
Dustin

Post edited by: eMusicMan, at: 2007/04/17 19:05

As far as I know(I am sure someone else will chime in if I am:P ), the rear turn signals aren't suppose to be running lights. They have a single wire that feeds them, unlike the front which have three, one for running lights, one for the blinking when you initiate the turn signal, and a ground wire. So they are working correctly as they are now;)

Peachc is correct, your lights are working as designed.

Dustin,

The rear signals on your bike should actually have 2 wires - one is power the other is ground.
If you have your heart set on having rear running lights, it's a pretty easy (albeit not always cheap) task. All you need to do is get another set of front signals, connect the turn signal wires and grounds wires as they were before, then just tie the 3rd wire into the tail light wire.


I did this on my ZN700, and it sure provides an added feeling of security at night by being more visible/distinguishable from a vehicle approaching from behind.

RetroRiceRocketRider wrote:
If you have your heart set on having rear running lights, it's a pretty easy (albeit not always cheap) task...[/quote]

Wow - so the way it is now (no running lights in the rear) is normal? I just assumed that since all cars have front and rear running lights, so would a motorcycle. Go figure!

I think I just may take on your idea as a future project... thanks!

-D

Don't believe these guys... check for yourself. Open up a rear turnsignal. Twist the bulb and pull it out. Count the contacts on the bulb. If there is ONE then you have only turn signal function. If you have two, you turn signal and running light function. A single contact bulb can't work in a dual contact bulb holder or vise versa. The single contact is dead in the middle of the bulb and the two contact are two smaller contacts that sit next to each other. To convert to running lights, contact z1enterprises.com. Ask them for the K&S replacement turn signals for the FRONT of your bike where there are running lights. These turn signals will look the same as the ones on the bike but have a bulb holder with two contacts. You will unplug/unscrew your current turn signals and then screw in the replacements. The K&S wire code is RED for running lamp, BLACK/WHITE for ground and BLACK for blinker. You will likely have to cut off the too-small male K&S connectors and put some BLUE crimp on connectors on your new turn signals. Plug them in: gray or green female on the wiring harness to the BLACK K&S lead. Connect the black/yellow to the BLACK/WHITE K&S lead. In the bunch of wires where the turn signals plug in will be a RED wire on the stock wiring harness. This is the RUNNING LIGHT on the brake. Bare some insulation and tie both RED leads from the K&S turn signals to the bared spot. Solder/shrink wrap and you now have rear running lights. Most states allow amber. Some states, like Texas allow amber OR red. Red is wayyyyy more fun; especially if you have blinking hazzards you can turn on... the blinking red light confuses the cager at night!

George - it's definitely a single-post bulb in the rear... that much I know (it's a #1073).

I think your solution is a bit cleaner, but I'm still shocked to find out that the tail lights are not normally running lights.

Thanks for the tip on z1enterprises.com - I think i'll be using them as a resource for many things in the future. Honestly, too, I'm glad there is nothing 'wrong' with my bike.

In a related question - why is it that my turn signals blink faster while revving compared to idling? I would think that the regulator would be ensuring constant voltage to avoid such changes? You seem to know a lot about the electrical side of things...

Thank you,
D

Lights off.....



Lights on.....


They're even brighter looking at night!

some states dont allow you to have anything but a red light on while running in the rear, thats why the rear is a single element bulb

There are two reasons the lights might blink fast. First thing I think I would do is check the reg/rec to ensure it is healthy. This is an easy check with a multimeter. Put the meter in VDC scale... Start the bike. Put the BLACK probe (neg) on the negative battery post. Put the RED probe (pos) on the positive battery post. At idle, the reading should be ~12.5 VDC. Rev engine to 4K rpm. Reading should be ~14.5 VDC. If the readings vary; such as significantly higher, then your reg/rec is becoming marginal and should be replaced. The higher voltage will cause the turn signal relay to blink faster.

The second possible reason is that someone changed turn signal bulbs at some dim point in the past. The OEM bulbs were Stanley bulbs and those had a rating not normally found in today's modern bulbs. If you have single filament bulbs and they are 1156 automotive type, then someone has changed them out. The Stanley bulbs were lower wattage. If the fronts turn signals have a running light integrated, and they are 1157 type, they have been swapped out for the original bulbs. The 1156 or 1157 will be stamped on the bulb on the side of the metal part.

If the bulbs have been swapped, they carry a different load to the OEM blinker relay. This relay was not designed for this load so will act funny. On a car, when adding a trailer with additional turn signals, the car blinkers will blink real fast as a result of the added load... much like yours may be from the added load of the modern bulbs. That being the case, look at your flasher relay by unplugging it. It likely has a brown wire and orange wire attached and is hanging near the battery box. If you have emergency (auxiliary flashers), then there will be two of the relays... anyway, unplug the flasher relay and note that the contacts are arrayed in an L or | _ configuration. You can buy a replacement blinker relay at ANY autoparts store. Make sure you get the HEAVY DUTY relay with the same contact configuration. It may or may not be the same shape as your OEM relay but will work as long as the contacts are the same. The HD relay will handle a wider range of electrical loads and your blinkers will flash at a normal rate. They use these on car/trucks that pull trailers when additional blinkers are used for this very reason.

wiredgeorge wrote:

This is an easy check with a multimeter. Put the meter in VDC scale... Start the bike. Put the BLACK probe (neg) on the negative battery post. Put the RED probe (pos) on the positive battery post. At idle, the reading should be ~12.5 VDC. Rev engine to 4K rpm. Reading should be ~14.5 VDC. If the readings vary; such as significantly higher, then your reg/rec is becoming marginal and should be replaced.

I think I did this before and cant recall the result - I'm going to give it another go tonight or this weekend and check into this.

The second possible reason is that someone changed turn signal bulbs at some dim point in the past...

Yesterday I noticed the rear turn signals have a 1073 (single-post) bulb in them... but I have to say that one bit of information I have not been able to find is what was the OEM bulb-type (all around) for my cycle? I think the 1073s must be the OEM for the rear, but what about the front? If you have any leads on this info - I'd appreciate it! I checked my Clymer and Kawasaki manuals without much luck.

I think I might be looking at the reg/rec replacement since it's not only the blinker. In general at night the headlight dims/brightens.

One more 'oddity' to throw your way is that when in a high-rev condition (@4k+ rpm) both the Oil and Gas lights start to light up, and get brighter as rpms increase. Is this also the same reg/rec issue?

Thank you so much for all the help. Now that the engine is working right I feel I finally can get into fixing some other parts on this bike.

Cheers,
D

Check to make sure that your battery is still connected, and that your charging system is working properly.

A while back I was in the same position with my 550 - the Oil and Fuel lights would come on and go off, but only at higher RPM. It turned out that the (+) connection on the battery was loose and not fully juiced. Once I stopped and tightened the screw down, it was fine again.

If that happens again, I'll know it's an electrical issue. It sounds like your bike is running off the alternator only to me..at high RPM, and the bike is complaining.

I could be wrong..but that's the conclusion I came to when it happened to me. My bike eventually just cut out when I was waiting at a stop light and fidling with the highbeam/brakelights/turn signals to see if I could figure out what the hell was wrong..