Stubborn engine mounting bolt - solved!

This weekend I tried to get the engine out of my Z1000A1, as I will be doing an overhaul on it (cylinder head, new Wiseco 10.25:1 pistons, fresh cylinder block) this tuesday. All bolts but one came out with some forceful encouragement, but the front mounting bolt (the long one that goes through the engine at two points) would not budge. The bolt is rusty chromed steel, and has more or less fused with the front left hole in the engine case. I managed to get the engine out by sawing through the bolt, but I am still left with a useless engine if I do not manage to get this bolt out. Any tips?

PB Blaster or Kroil applied after using a propane torch(let the bolt cool a little)usually loosens up stubborn fasteners.

When re-installing the bolts/screws, use some of the silver anti-seize on the first few threads as it will make removal much easier next time.

What MFolks said, plus BFH, aka Harley tool, aka large hammer.

+1 on anti-sieze.

Zthou1977 wrote:

...managed to get the engine out by sawing through the bolt....

At what point along the bolt was the bolt sawed apart? Between the left front mount and engine?

How much of the bolt remains intact?

Am visualizing motor on bench with bolt through right mount, running on through right engine hole, into left engine hole, and sawed off flush with left side of left engine hole.
With left front engine mount having been removed from frame downtube.

Pic?

Good Fortune!

As Mfolks posted: Turn engine on its side,get some PBBlaster,squirt as much as u can in the holes where the frozen bolt(s) is/are--let the PB Blaster work overnight--heat the bolt--let it cool--get a good center punch or piece of small round steel and a dead blow hammer and wail away.It should pop out.Cover cases with a blanket or something in case ur aim is bad--dont want to break any thing off. off.bj

Bump.Before u reassemble,get ur Dremel and a small wire brush or a piece of Scotchbrite pad and clean the holes out before u put the bolt back in.As has been posted by Mfolks use some anti-seize or white lithium gease to avoid further freeze ups.bj

if the penatrating oil fails, just drill it out.

Patton wrote:

Zthou1977 wrote:

...managed to get the engine out by sawing through the bolt....

At what point along the bolt was the bolt sawed apart? Between the left front mount and engine?
How much of the bolt remains intact?

Exactly, but first I managed (with the engine/frame on its side) to slide the engine over 5-7mm. I then sawed flush with the frame lug, so there is 5 to 7 mm sticking out of the engine mount while the frame is still completely intact. I needed a protruding end to be able to use my BFH.
Yesterday I used he hammer on the other end, where the nut was. Today I had had enough and 'liberated' the engine by sawing through the bolt. So far I only gave it some oil. As usual the WD40 ran out at the most inopportune moment.

Am visualizing motor on bench with bolt through right mount, running on through right engine hole, into left engine hole, and sawed off flush with left side of left engine hole.
With left front engine mount having been removed from frame downtube.

The motor is out of the frame, but still has the bolt through the right engine hole (which is oversized and where the bolt moves from side to side of the hole), and through the left engine hole, where it protrudes some 5-7mm. I can use the BFH on both sides, as on the other side the threaded end is sticking out.

Problem is: the oversized hole for this 10mm bolt is (apart from the bolt itself) completely filled with a mixture of brown rust and whitish aluminum oxide. At this point I am thinking the last time this engine has been removed from the frame must have been 20 years or longer ago.
As the hole is completely filled/sealed with this stuff, I don't think the PB Blaster (is this like WD40?) can penetrate and dissolve the stuff.
I've tried heat with a hot air gun (it gets _really_ hot), but that doesn't shift the stuff. What kind of torch is safe to use? Is propane okay?

Pic?

Sorry, I do not have a digital camera. Actually I should have borrowed my G/F's camera, to document the before/during/after stages of the rebuild.

drill a few "pilot" holes in the goop and shoot the PB Blaster in there.WD-40 is a cleaner.PB Blaster is a rust eater.If anything can be loosened up from rust that stuff can do it.I am a bit confused as well.On my KZ,the engine mounting bolt runs thru the mounting tabs on both sides as does yours.However,my bike has a metal tube BETWEEN the mounting tabs that keeps water and goop off the mounting bolt.Is yours missing?If so,that may explain why so much rust and oxide in the mounting tabs and around the bolt.Might want to consider finding one of those before u reassemble..bj

hocbj23 wrote:

drill a few "pilot" holes in the goop and shoot the PB Blaster in there.WD-40 is a cleaner.PB Blaster is a rust eater.If anything can be loosened up from rust that stuff can do it.

Aha, I'll make sure to get some.

I am a bit confused as well.On my KZ,the engine mounting bolt runs thru the mounting tabs on both sides as does yours.However,my bike has a metal tube BETWEEN the mounting tabs that keeps water and goop off the mounting bolt.Is yours missing?If so,that may explain why so much rust and oxide in the mounting tabs and around the bolt.Might want to consider finding one of those before u reassemble..bj

I couldn't find anything on this in the manual. Are we talking about the same bolt? The bolt I am talking about is #13 in the picture. Such a tube would be a very good idea though. I just cannot understand why the guy who last assembled this last time didn't use some copper grease or similar stuff. Such a simple preventative measure saves such an awful lot of grief later on...

Yes, it's okay to use propane torch to heat engine case area around frozen shaft of bolt.

On the nut end (brake side of bike), would it be possible to fit a washer or two onto the bolt threads, then start the nut, and gradually tighten the nut against the washers so as to pull the bolt shaft through both engine holes?

If decide to drill into sawed end of bolt, be very careful to get most accurate center punch possible, to allow maximum cutting when using successively larger drill bits, without damaging the engine hole. Perhaps the "walls" of the remaining bolt portion after drilling will be thin enough to be picked away from and out of the engine case hole.

Good Fortune!

Patton wrote:

On the nut end (brake side of bike), would it be possible to fit a washer or two onto the bolt threads, then start the nut, and gradually tighten the nut against the washers so as to pull the bolt shaft through both engine holes?

Maybe, if I repair the thread. The hammer did some damage on the end of the bolt.
First I'll get some PB Blaster or something similar. We just do not get the same stuff here (in Holland): Seafoam and that Lucas ZDDF additive for instance are unavailable.
First I'll use the PB Blaster, followed by heat from a propane torch, all the while hammering away.
If all else fails, I'll use a drill. Since this would be just a simple hand-held, it probably won't do much good. Maybe I'll rent a car and get the engine to a specialist.

Good Fortune!

Thanks!